w00t! pr0n! except not.

[reenka]

Ahhhh, stellabelle so owns me. Yeah, she wrote another H/D fic and yeah, I'm so in love with it I have to pimp it in this most embarrassing fashion. Ahem.

Possibly this might have to do with the fact that it's called `I Have A Girlfriend, You Fucker!'. I think this and this alone could make me fall over from the sheer beauty of it all.

Also, after the_leaky's unfortunate descent into angst, I so needed this, man. Besides, there are references to like, British things in it. Like... like Kensington. Oh, the love. As well as easy!Draco and rather-stupid-but-eager!Harry. The world really should work like this. I mean, it may not, but DAMMIT IT SHOULD. Actually, it -does-, doesn't it?

Comments

[bookshop.livejournal.com]

This makes me happy.

Have been drowning in Draco and canon for 7 hours straight, man.

My essay SUCKS. The only conclusion I have drawn is that Harry won't be satisfied until he shags Malfoy into the ground. The poncy fuck.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

I really likeds your essay, but I just woke up and my commentary would likely consist of "gaaahbuuuuhpretty". But your conclusion is sound. "The only conclusion I have drawn is that Harry won't be satisfied until he shags Malfoy into the ground. The poncy fuck.". You should write fic, ahaha.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Heheh I'll read it in a bit, when I'm through skimming the Veela fic mindlessly :>
Though tsk, canon!Draco & Pansy's love is pure & true ;)) Though it'd be fun to have a 'queer reading' of him, all official-like :> Theoretically, however, you don't need a conclusion so much as a thesis, or at least a slant :> You can't 'conclude' anything if you're not arguing anything more than 'this is an interesting character and I like him, you should too'.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

REENA ARE YOU AWAKE? I WANNA CHAT. >:O

[malafede.livejournal.com]

Man, a queer reading of Draco and Pansy's love is what would be really fun.

(I refuse to modify Draco as "canon". >:O Is there any other form of Draco??? >:O)

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Man, I love `The Veela Enigma'. Heee. I love shutting off my brain. I love switch!Harry/Draco, eheheheh >:D

Er, I'm awake but it's 6am, so... not very.
And sure, there are other forms-- whether or not they're IC is another matter, but they exist and are recognized by a lot of people as 'Draco' which probably means they should be studied from a literary criticism standpoint.

Draco & Pansy's love is so not queer o_0 In fact, it strikes me as completely heteronormative o_0 They're so predictable together it hurts. Oh yeah, that sort of thing NEVER HAPPENs in real life-- they're rebels is what they are. REBELS AGAINST SOCIETY AS THEY KNOW IT. *snorts*

...lately I think I only like H/D -when- I turn off my brain ^^;;;

[malafede.livejournal.com]

(Whether or not they are IC matters to me, not sure if from a literary criticism standpoint, given that if he is not IC he is not Draco.)

(I have just made up a new word that makes me as happy as upgrade Draco. It is slashnormative.)

[malafede.livejournal.com]

And I meant a queer reading of Draco and Pansy's love as a reading of their relationship which read Draco as queer, but a flamewar of the relative merits of canon and fanon works too.

No, you're right that it happens all the time in real life, too bad it never happens in fic because everymen with their little annoying uncool flaws are not romance material, oh woe.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Harry likes being mean to Draco. -I- like being mean to Draco. It's a happy, happy thing. Ahhhhhhhh joy.

Ahem. Where was I?

IC is a very flexible, subjective thing. You can believe you know what 'IC' is with 100% certainty, but unless you're JKR and thus the author, what you have is an interpretation and an educated guess. A single reading among a plethora of readings. There can't really be a single, definitive entity called 'in character' Draco-- only a bunch of things you'd need to do a lot more explaining for than others. So as a lit-crit thing, people's perceptions are enough to make a study of almost any interpretation valid/interesting. Man... in fact, in most lit-crit movements, the extent things get taken seem actually more insane than in fandom (...and I'm not even a 'real' English major, but close enough to know).


I keep thinking about this whole 'upgrade' thing. Eh, I suppose it's true, but if so, I fully believe it's perfectly valid-- just as rehashing canon in one's fic is as valid as reinventing or extending it. To me, since I'm so far from plot-centric, it's difficult to extend canon through events-- I can only work on personality traits. I like writing about Draco because he's passionate, desperate, angry, needy, and doomed... so of course I want to take him to a new level. It's... implicit. If one -doesn't-, then I'd consider it a 'bleh' sort of fanfic, anyway. Characters should develop. Something should happen to them-- and yeah, hopefully it's a -positive- something, an upgrade, an improvement-- something that doesn't ruin their souls and mess up their minds. That'd be nice.

And yeaaah I like redeeming Draco, not from his 'evil', but from his future and the rut he's in and the choices he's not aware he's letting others make for him. It's not what most people call redemption, but it's what -I- call it. ...I just believe I can still be IC and do it :>

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

It's not the flaws that make Draco/Pansy not that popular to write-- certainly, Ron/Hermione is a popular pairing and it's got plenty of flaws and incompatibilities and Ron's got a horrible temper and Hermione's a control-freak-- it's not that people don't like that. Things like R/Hr also happen a lot in real life, btw.

The thing with Draco/Pansy that makes it less than interesting is that we know next to nothing about Pansy, Draco is really rather gay, and there's little narrative tension between them. There's no tension, no drama, no-- central burning issue. So basically, I'm saying that some things that are 'real' or common just aren't as interesting when put down on paper 'cause they're... not very dramatic.

Like... most people read to be entertained, which is why they read about two people in love/lust in the first place, right-- and not about two people going grocery shopping :>

[malafede.livejournal.com]

The word redemption which describes a concept very dear to me in general terms has been completely ruined for me by the HP fandom. Draco needs to be redeemed from his future? By your same logic you don't know Draco's future if you aren't JKR. Plus, that's so unfair. I don't know whether Draco is going to fuck up splendidly in the future, but I am going to assume he will so I can sick some epic archetype on him that makes him look more romantic than an annoying everybrat.

The whole argument for "not there being an universal standard of ICness" makes my head hurt. Like, by your reasoning The Gentleman is IC too. Or Boyd Draco. There is a JKR's Draco Malfoy, if you ask any kid reading the books they will say everything about it.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

There's no tension, no drama, no-- central burning issue.

The only thing D/P lacks is the super-duper powers of superhumanity.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

I dunno-- I mean, can you define a ship like that, rather than just a writer? Or you could say a canon depiction makes characters seems over-the-top and overly 'good' and glorious, but if the canon doesn't, then theoretically there's some not-so-glorious characterizations of the popular ships, too. I've certainly read dark, not-so-uber-human Harry/Ginny and hey, Ron/Hermione and Snape/Hermione and dude, I do read way more het than I'd realized :>

I was trying to talk about narrative structure and how one needs a central conflict to make a pairing have mass appeal-- some... drive. It also helps to fit into a larger cliche but that's mostly 'cause most writers/readers are inexperienced and have pre-existing expectations & desires. Both of these seem unrelated to any conscious desire to uber-glorify the characters-- I'd argue that the only cases where this would really be true would be instances of Mary Sues anyway. And most people's Pansy is as Mary Sue as they come, btw.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

Ron's got a horrible temper and Hermione's a control-freak-- it's not that people don't like that. Things like R/Hr also happen a lot in real life, btw.

Right, who thinks of Ron/Hermione in those terms? If you follow any discussion about the ship or the characters, you will find that Ron and Hermione are flawed but "just teenagers" and "their hearts are in the right place" and above all they are the good guys, and do cool amazing things with the hero. Draco and Pansy aren't cool. They don't do any cool amazing thing. They are lame, and pathetic, and represent, whether their author did it purposely or not, a jungian shadow to the main character and even the reader. They are the lame half of the everyman. Nobody cares about humanity because humanity, when not romanticised to some degree, is deeply uncool.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

I've certainly read dark, not-so-uber-human Harry/Ginny and hey, Ron/Hermione and Snape/Hermione

Dark has mass appeal too, you know, as in cool. The reason why DE fic is so popular is mainly that. I'm sure there's people who are into it for less shiny reasons, but a lot of people go for that goth poseur thing.

mass appeal-- some... drive.

Mass appeal is not drive. Mass appeal mostly plays on the desire of the audience to escape reality.

Pansy is as Mary Sue as they come, btw.

Because all Mary Sues get described as pug-faced and called stupid cows by the main heroine...?

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Oh, but plenty of people think Draco & Pansy are cool separately-- just, not so much together. There are lots of fics with Draco-- clearly the fandom thinks that whatever they believe is 'Draco' is cool enough to write fics about. As for Pansy, there's lots of her also, just not necessarily with Draco. I do believe it's the ship in particular that isn't dramatic, not the characters themselves. I think most people would say that Draco by himself is one of the most (overly) dramatic characters in HP :> Anyway, their 'common-man' aspects wouldn't be enough to stop most people (since most people would just overlook that and infuse coolness artificially) if that's all it was.

However, you're right-- they're not cool. That's what I meant-- Ron & Hermione aren't 'cool' but they're -made- cool because that's how the fandom wants to see them (ie, bias, yeay!) and because their dynamic together plugs into a common pre-existing cliche, which D/P doesn't.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

I fully believe it's perfectly valid

Plus, the thing is I agree with character developement being valid, and the only reason I am arguing this is that 1) "They're so predictable together it hurts." and "I'm saying that some things that are 'real' or common just aren't as interesting" which are all statements that make me twitch because it seems that in order to pump up your vision you choose to put down mine 2) I don't at all conflate development and upgrades. Characters are made to upgrade in order to make them shinier, they are made to develope in order to make them more human.

Also this whole "not enough, not enough, must upgrade" is what makes me avoid mainstream romance as the plague and consequentially makes me want to shoot myself in the head about fanon Draco.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

We're totally talking about different things, which means we're talking past each other and omg I'm only awake for Aja's sake and I'm not even reading her essay and it's 7am and my mother'll wake up soon and I have to go now, like for real, who the hell's awake at 7am without sleeping???! But.

Anyway.
Mass appeal mostly plays on the desire of the audience to escape reality.
I was talking about narrative design, the writer's end of things-- it's not about audience, I meant mass appeal for writers, meaning questions about the narrative structure and how a story's built and how it hangs together and what makes good conflict/drama/angst. This isn't about audience. Audience is an entirely different issue which doesn't explain why things do or don't get written, just whether or not they become popular. D/P is vaguely popular to the extent that it's written, which isn't very great.

Because all Mary Sues get described as pug-faced and called stupid cows by the main heroine...?
I meant, in this case, audience percepion of Pansy, not your perception or the 'IC' perception or JKR's intent-- I was talking about popularity of characters determining whether they get used, and in this case, Pansy is popular in fandom for whatever reason and is Mary Sued a lot, too. Is it IC? No, but most people don't care, thusly you can't use the argument 'but she's uncool' to explain why anyone avoids writing her, since they don't stop to see her as IC long enough to avoid her for that reason.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Ah well, with the 'not as interesting' thing, I meant to explain why people (...this 'mass' who doesn't see the light of D/P and the normal sort of romance without uber-men) would dislike certain aspects of the pairing. Which aren't dramatic. So it's 'not as interesting' in a very particular way, and I say this as an observation of behavior, not a judgment on humanity.

...And anyway, I wouldn't use 'upgrade' as a term, myself, it's just that you use it on me & I resist as I'm able. I always said it didn't fit my plans for ickle Malfoy, right? :> But fanfic itself seems to be about a drive for -development-, which yeah, can be about canon/'as is' characterization not being 'enough'-- but that's not a slam on humanity, just the writer of said canon.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

But eh, that's fanon you're talking about. The fanon is dramatic, the canon is OVER dramatic, as in funny and not especially tear-jerking or meaningful in that epic way. Oh, and hooray for lack of clichè...? Though I could argue there's plenty of "partners in crime" clichès that would fit, it's just that the gay thing is more appealing for some reason. >:D

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

I'm trying to explain people's behavior & root it in reasonable, predictable patterns, that is all :>

[malafede.livejournal.com]

But I have no problem with this "mass" (are you trying to make me sound l33t? Ahaha. I am not the one who spits on funny losers :/), I have problem with the rejection of it as objectively uninteresting - as a consequence of trends in pop culture that go far deeper than HP. Mainstream culture as a whole conflates lack of drama with lack of conflict. I use upgrade at you because when you talk about the Fool I agree and then have to headdesk when the Fool's journey as you describe it goes from personal to epic. :)

[malafede.livejournal.com]

This sounds like you mean I am trying their behaviour as unelightened. I was thinking that probably I am actually saying that romance is unenlightened. Maybe I just feel a little oppressed.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Oh, he doesn't need to be redeemed, I just like envisioning it, because while I wouldn't claim his future is set in stone, I feel less than full of faith in the direction (whatever it is) JKR's about to take him in, or any fanfic writer I've seen, either. So... as long as it's not -my- future for him, I'm dissatisfied anyway. And I know I'm misusing the whole 'redemption' thing, but... I do believe he's trapped by himself, as we all are, and that he needs to grow up, as we all do, and that process of spiritual/personal growth-- that's redemption, to me. But even so, I'm not forcing it on anyone-- I mean, how could I? Even if I say, 'IT SHOULD HAPPEN OR FEAR MY WRATH!', I'm just joking, I don't expect anyone to be like, 'OMG REENA SAID DRACO MUST GROW UP, WE BETTER START WRITING FICS TO HER SPECIFICATIONS!!1' (...not that I'd -mind-, necessarily, but alas...)

Anyway, I don't want to go into the painfully obvious 'but no, that's not what I meant' with ICness since I've talked about it 18297439874 times and god am I sick of talking about Draco and HP canon AAAARGH. But.

I meant there's no standard outside of fact, but you can play with facts an awful lot, too, -if- you make things plausible & reasonable and tie various behaviors or occurrences to specific root causes in events from canon. If you're careful, you can -justify- a certain Draco by going from point A to B in the story-- just as long as he's got some basic consistency at the very least in Harry's perception of him and his behavior. There has to be a transition, but the base potential and motivators are largely open to lots of interpretation as far as causality.

I like epic archetypes. Eh. It's a Reena thing.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

I say nothing of enlightenment, only of predictability & the obvious nature of how people will tend to react. As for how enlightened people are, as well as their desires and imaginings-- not at all. This is a long-established truth of the world, I thought.