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reenkaMan. I just made a poll about this, and now it's come up in real life-- really awkwardly.
To backtrack & for background, I'm trying to write a novella (novel??) in a month with my rl friend this January. We meet several times a week to write together, heheh, and so far it's been really effective at getting me to write (it's the writing-class effect). While I do finish a fanfic that's on my mind (eventually), with original fic it may take years for me to get to the end (or I'll just drop it 'cause I get bored). I dunno if anyone else experiences this phenomenon-- I guess I'm the same in original fic or fanfic, it's just that I get a lot more ideas for fanfic (or, I used to *sniff*), so even though I still quit on 80%, that still leaves a huge number of finished fics as far as I'm concerned. But anyway.
Yeah, so generally we don't discuss our stories much except to talk meta about the process a bit, though she (my friend) mentioned about how over-the-top everyone is in her fic and how she plans to fix that in the edits afterwards when I said I'm writing even though I'm pretty sure it sucks. And I'm like, 'yeah, though generally I don't think my work sucks'-- that's not why I have writer's block. Why do people assume that? (My mom's advice before I dropped my last creative writing class was 'writing even though you think it sucks'). I mean, I just have no inspiration-- why does that mean I have to think I suck? I know I don't suck :P When I do think I suck, it's because I do, and generally umm, it's not enough to stop me (good self-esteem, that would be me, yeaaaah.)
Somehow we got on the subject of melodramatic/cliched/flowery (bad?) writing, and that's when my friend started to get defensive. I said I sorta wished I could write in the 'popular' style, plot-wise-- that is, I sometimes get bitter & wish writing cliched romantic melodrama came easier to me, because it's certainly not hard, per se. I was trying to be understanding & saying that it's all good as long as you try to be good at what you do (in terms of genre/style), and she just kept repeating about how she doesn't aspire to "high literature" and how she didn't like Tolstoy. I mean. I couldn't get into 'War and Peace' either & I certainly don't tend to either write or read high literature, but what does this have to do with having standards & wanting to be Really Good at your craft? (Well, I know my friend is just personally v. either/or and hardline about her opinions, but still....)
I was trying to be all mediating & compromising, and then she asked my opinion of writing like Mercedes Lackey, 'cause that's what she sees herself doing. And. Uh. I used to like her (when I was 14) and I said so, to which she replied she'd always liked 'young' writing, which she takes to mean clear-cut in theme & ornate in style. But style can be ornate without being repetitive & cliched & just PAINFUL TO CONTEMPLATE, like Mercedes Lackey certainly is :/ Her earlier work was intriguing, esp. to an overly romantic teenage girl who liked white horsies (SHUT UP), but now it's just embarrassing :/ :/ Why would anyone want to be like her -now-?
I dunno. Suddenly I'm doubting that over-the-top/flowery writing is necessarily bad (well, there's an audience for it, obviously, and apparently some writers who know they're like that & don't care). And yet. I dunno. I just think it's important to want to get better, to grow as a writer, and defensiveness about not writing 'high literature' has no place in someone (like my friend) who wants to write seriously & get published. How is it I'm more 'serious' than her in this sense even though I don't care about getting published? 'Serious' in quotes 'cause I know she's really serious about being a writer. I mean, this is especially relevant to me 'cause I wasn't just born writing non-ornately-- far from it; in fact, everything about me is naturally ornate (if not melodramatic); my HS writing teacher called my writing [too] 'ecstatic', and I've tried really hard to get past that. :/
And then she said 'this is why I never show anyone my writing' -.-;; Ouch. *facepalm* I wonder if flowery-melodrama-writing people really are more sensitive and over-the-top themselves (I know my friend is ♥) hehe. (Though hey, I'm sensitive too, dammit... hmf.)
To backtrack & for background, I'm trying to write a novella (novel??) in a month with my rl friend this January. We meet several times a week to write together, heheh, and so far it's been really effective at getting me to write (it's the writing-class effect). While I do finish a fanfic that's on my mind (eventually), with original fic it may take years for me to get to the end (or I'll just drop it 'cause I get bored). I dunno if anyone else experiences this phenomenon-- I guess I'm the same in original fic or fanfic, it's just that I get a lot more ideas for fanfic (or, I used to *sniff*), so even though I still quit on 80%, that still leaves a huge number of finished fics as far as I'm concerned. But anyway.
Yeah, so generally we don't discuss our stories much except to talk meta about the process a bit, though she (my friend) mentioned about how over-the-top everyone is in her fic and how she plans to fix that in the edits afterwards when I said I'm writing even though I'm pretty sure it sucks. And I'm like, 'yeah, though generally I don't think my work sucks'-- that's not why I have writer's block. Why do people assume that? (My mom's advice before I dropped my last creative writing class was 'writing even though you think it sucks'). I mean, I just have no inspiration-- why does that mean I have to think I suck? I know I don't suck :P When I do think I suck, it's because I do, and generally umm, it's not enough to stop me (good self-esteem, that would be me, yeaaaah.)
Somehow we got on the subject of melodramatic/cliched/flowery (bad?) writing, and that's when my friend started to get defensive. I said I sorta wished I could write in the 'popular' style, plot-wise-- that is, I sometimes get bitter & wish writing cliched romantic melodrama came easier to me, because it's certainly not hard, per se. I was trying to be understanding & saying that it's all good as long as you try to be good at what you do (in terms of genre/style), and she just kept repeating about how she doesn't aspire to "high literature" and how she didn't like Tolstoy. I mean. I couldn't get into 'War and Peace' either & I certainly don't tend to either write or read high literature, but what does this have to do with having standards & wanting to be Really Good at your craft? (Well, I know my friend is just personally v. either/or and hardline about her opinions, but still....)
I was trying to be all mediating & compromising, and then she asked my opinion of writing like Mercedes Lackey, 'cause that's what she sees herself doing. And. Uh. I used to like her (when I was 14) and I said so, to which she replied she'd always liked 'young' writing, which she takes to mean clear-cut in theme & ornate in style. But style can be ornate without being repetitive & cliched & just PAINFUL TO CONTEMPLATE, like Mercedes Lackey certainly is :/ Her earlier work was intriguing, esp. to an overly romantic teenage girl who liked white horsies (SHUT UP), but now it's just embarrassing :/ :/ Why would anyone want to be like her -now-?
I dunno. Suddenly I'm doubting that over-the-top/flowery writing is necessarily bad (well, there's an audience for it, obviously, and apparently some writers who know they're like that & don't care). And yet. I dunno. I just think it's important to want to get better, to grow as a writer, and defensiveness about not writing 'high literature' has no place in someone (like my friend) who wants to write seriously & get published. How is it I'm more 'serious' than her in this sense even though I don't care about getting published? 'Serious' in quotes 'cause I know she's really serious about being a writer. I mean, this is especially relevant to me 'cause I wasn't just born writing non-ornately-- far from it; in fact, everything about me is naturally ornate (if not melodramatic); my HS writing teacher called my writing [too] 'ecstatic', and I've tried really hard to get past that. :/
And then she said 'this is why I never show anyone my writing' -.-;; Ouch. *facepalm* I wonder if flowery-melodrama-writing people really are more sensitive and over-the-top themselves (I know my friend is ♥) hehe. (Though hey, I'm sensitive too, dammit... hmf.)
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Date: 2007-01-20 05:08 am (UTC)But yeah it seems like...I don't know what all you said but it seems like her defensiveness was already in place as she was the one who defined herself as doing that and then wasn't happy when the conversation turned towards that type of writing. (I wouldn't actually think that liking that sort of thing means you wouldn't like War & Peace either--those things don't stand out as two opposite extremes in my mind.;-)
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Date: 2007-01-20 05:23 am (UTC)Well, I certainly wasn't trying to make her -more- defensive (you know I don't push, haha), but she was pushing herself. And I couldn't hide my distaste for over-the-top cliches/floweriness entirely (considering I REALLY REALLY REALLY hate it, I was doing a good job of being mild). But yeah, Tolstoy is right up that alley... he's even clear-cut morally, hahaha.... I think a lot of it is that she's intimidated by the idea that that's "high literature" or something.