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reenkaSeeing yet another rant on the ev01 that is unsolicited con-crit, I just have to wonder... where -is- it??! I don't see it! So where! Where! WHERE??!
...It's not just that -my- stories never get con-critted except by my close friends (sometimes rarely maybe), it's that I like -never- see con-crit on anything I read in HP on lj, and I do browse comments. Forget crit, I don't tend to see more than 5 words at a time (because typing is hard work, y'know). I sometimes get "crit" (like, 'oh, that was confusing' or 'write more' or 'omg INCEST'-- I dunno if that counts, more like flames and general grumbles I guess, but I'm desperate) on Fiction Alley, but the closest I've ever come to seeing con-crit on an HP story on lj in the last year or two was someone pointing out that a g-spot wasn't a prostate, nonono. (Even I was tempted to make an anony!comment with that one.)
...Yes, indeed. (Hello, fandom. Good-bye, fandom.)
Possibly there's all this critique going on other fandoms that I just don't see. I mean, not that it keeps me up nights, 'cause mostly I just don't -care- and find all this hilarious to the max, but... still. I realize HP fandom would implode with wank were crit to be more common, but maybe there's all this crit made on like, Snape/McGonagall stories, so of course I never see it.
Just to make it clear, I'm not really implying con-crit -helps- or anything. I just like it; I like thinking about fiction analytically, my own and others'. Keeps mah brains sharp as feathers, and so on. Um. Call me crazy, etcetc. But I do have to admit I don't really -want- con-crit, not really-- what I -want- is to discuss stories, talk about them with other writers and readers. Detailed feedback is just the same as 'con-crit' to my mind, 'cause it's basically all the same anyway; any detailed feedback wouldn't be 100% positive if it was honest, so. But positive isn't the point so much as a bonus, to me.
Actually, I'm one of those people who cringe and have to admit that they don't write fanfic to improve themselves nor do they edit-- that is, I mean well and I -want- to edit and theoretically become a better person/writer/wanker/etc, but basically I don't 'cause I'm too lazy. So if you do point out something wrong with a fic of mine, odds are I'll get a happy light in my eyes, exclaim 'yes! thanks! wow, you're right!' and then never touch it again 'cause it's Too Much Effort. Though I don't have the excuse of 'but I have a -real- life to concentrate on, PLEBIANS!!1', because I don't, but still.
I just find it ironic, I guess, 'cause unsolicited con-crit is so hard to come by as to be very -very- rare and precious. Perhaps I'm just in the wrong fandom, and this one's just too big and/or has the wrong demographic and/or I picked the wrong pairing (....let's just not go there). Perhaps some people attract it more. And by 'some people' I really mean people who write long, popular fics that lots of people read so at least -some- of them would crit. Well then, I'll just be going now. Heh.
...No, no, I have to get this off my chest:
When people say they're "in this for fun"-- you see, it seems I have a different definition of 'fun' than they do, and that's fine, it's just that they don't realize that their fun is not my fun. Why does fun have to = mindless and/or pleasant? And where does that leave people for whom mindless = unpleasant?
I think the very fact that I can ask that question shows you why I never go to parties. ^^; Or, well, uh, deal well with 'groups' together with 'entertainment'.... ><;;;;; *facepalm* But that may or may not be merely a tangent. Suffice it to say, this is all about the conflict between writing as a group social activity and writing as a personal quest for [whatever]. I sort of appreciate both aspects, but it really gets to me when there are so many people going, 'but we're not really writers, we're fanfic writers, so LEAVE US ALONE-- I MEAN NO, NOT ALONE, OBVIOUSLY WE'RE NOT -LIKE- THAT, BUT--' ...Yeah -.-
...It's not just that -my- stories never get con-critted except by my close friends (sometimes rarely maybe), it's that I like -never- see con-crit on anything I read in HP on lj, and I do browse comments. Forget crit, I don't tend to see more than 5 words at a time (because typing is hard work, y'know). I sometimes get "crit" (like, 'oh, that was confusing' or 'write more' or 'omg INCEST'-- I dunno if that counts, more like flames and general grumbles I guess, but I'm desperate) on Fiction Alley, but the closest I've ever come to seeing con-crit on an HP story on lj in the last year or two was someone pointing out that a g-spot wasn't a prostate, nonono. (Even I was tempted to make an anony!comment with that one.)
...Yes, indeed. (Hello, fandom. Good-bye, fandom.)
Possibly there's all this critique going on other fandoms that I just don't see. I mean, not that it keeps me up nights, 'cause mostly I just don't -care- and find all this hilarious to the max, but... still. I realize HP fandom would implode with wank were crit to be more common, but maybe there's all this crit made on like, Snape/McGonagall stories, so of course I never see it.
Just to make it clear, I'm not really implying con-crit -helps- or anything. I just like it; I like thinking about fiction analytically, my own and others'. Keeps mah brains sharp as feathers, and so on. Um. Call me crazy, etcetc. But I do have to admit I don't really -want- con-crit, not really-- what I -want- is to discuss stories, talk about them with other writers and readers. Detailed feedback is just the same as 'con-crit' to my mind, 'cause it's basically all the same anyway; any detailed feedback wouldn't be 100% positive if it was honest, so. But positive isn't the point so much as a bonus, to me.
Actually, I'm one of those people who cringe and have to admit that they don't write fanfic to improve themselves nor do they edit-- that is, I mean well and I -want- to edit and theoretically become a better person/writer/wanker/etc, but basically I don't 'cause I'm too lazy. So if you do point out something wrong with a fic of mine, odds are I'll get a happy light in my eyes, exclaim 'yes! thanks! wow, you're right!' and then never touch it again 'cause it's Too Much Effort. Though I don't have the excuse of 'but I have a -real- life to concentrate on, PLEBIANS!!1', because I don't, but still.
I just find it ironic, I guess, 'cause unsolicited con-crit is so hard to come by as to be very -very- rare and precious. Perhaps I'm just in the wrong fandom, and this one's just too big and/or has the wrong demographic and/or I picked the wrong pairing (....let's just not go there). Perhaps some people attract it more. And by 'some people' I really mean people who write long, popular fics that lots of people read so at least -some- of them would crit. Well then, I'll just be going now. Heh.
...No, no, I have to get this off my chest:
When people say they're "in this for fun"-- you see, it seems I have a different definition of 'fun' than they do, and that's fine, it's just that they don't realize that their fun is not my fun. Why does fun have to = mindless and/or pleasant? And where does that leave people for whom mindless = unpleasant?
I think the very fact that I can ask that question shows you why I never go to parties. ^^; Or, well, uh, deal well with 'groups' together with 'entertainment'.... ><;;;;; *facepalm* But that may or may not be merely a tangent. Suffice it to say, this is all about the conflict between writing as a group social activity and writing as a personal quest for [whatever]. I sort of appreciate both aspects, but it really gets to me when there are so many people going, 'but we're not really writers, we're fanfic writers, so LEAVE US ALONE-- I MEAN NO, NOT ALONE, OBVIOUSLY WE'RE NOT -LIKE- THAT, BUT--' ...Yeah -.-
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no subject
Date: 2005-11-02 09:49 am (UTC)But that bit about laughing-and-crying was a theoretical aside, actually, which I later regretted, ahaha. Um. With the rant/wank... it's funny because it's stupid, too narrow-focused and repetitive, and frustrating for the same reason, as stupid things tend to be. I always readily accept my many contradictions, it's just that it all still makes the normal sort of sense in my own head, even if in no one else's, what can I say. -.-
Most of my fics aren't -quite- so confusing as my last one, but I -have- been working on my tendency for being obscure for -years- now, since I -know- it's an issue-- and I think there's been progress, comparatively, believe it or not. And it's not a question of me -fixing- things but rather liking the idea of a dialogue between reader & writer-- not saying it's realistic, just saying it would be nice. The point, as I tried to say, I believe, isn't to fix a fic or to improve my writing but just to -talk- analytically about fic, mine same as anyone's, because... I like to.
Besides this, as I said, I don't -have- an available beta anyway.... -And- I'm not really looking for one-- I wasn't talking about myself in the first place, largely. I said I'm mostly too lazy to edit because it's true. I think my fics overall have gotten 'cleaner' and/or tighter than they used to be merely through practice. Though if
Ó.o
Date: 2005-11-02 09:54 am (UTC)So you're saying you don't want concrit, you want metacrit?
haha
Date: 2005-11-02 10:04 am (UTC)In the end, what I would ideally like is a writer's workshop-type atmosphere, and I know it's unfair of me to expect it from a huge fandom like this, but it would really inspire me, and at one point I did experience something like it, near the beginning. I'm not picky about -how- you discuss a fic-- but the difference, I suppose, is mostly between discussion aimed at the writer (improving their craft and such) and the reader (to communicate with other readers and maybe the writer as well). I myself lean towards the latter, but think the two can be combined.
As I tried to say, sort of obliquely, there's an over-emphasis on crit as a tool to improve writing-- I don't believe it necessarily serves that function in all cases-- you can't count on it, in other words. But you -can- always have an interesting dialogue between readers and writers, and that's what's important to me.
Re: haha
Date: 2005-11-02 11:34 am (UTC)Okay okay. I was just getting clarification. Supposedly one of my redeeming values, or some shit.