~~bad news, batman.
Jun. 29th, 2005 06:59 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
reenkaIn the Bad News Dept: this wank is making me wibble like mad, but perhaps because of this the most:
It astounds me how anyone can find Harry falling in LOVE with Draco Malfoy isn't OOC.
It also astounds me how anyone can find Draco falling in LOVE with Potter isn't OOC as well.
...Mostly because I always fall for that 'rationalize your faith' straw man argument, nearly always made not by pairing agnostics (so to speak), whom I respect greatly and want to be somehow validated by, but by people with their own hidden agenda. It just really annoys me that people question concepts which -should- be questioned, but nearly always in the service of opposing bias. It's just one of those things which erodes my respect for people in general.
However, I have to say that's at least 70% of why I ship them so hard. I mean, there are other reasons, obviously, but the sheer impossibility is what I adore the most. So it hits really close to home when someone says 'why does Harry bother loving Draco' when he already does and Draco's already lovable, because, well, we're always going to go back to Harry's base disgust with Draco, and being way too in touch with my Harry muse, this sort of attitude drives me up the wall. And makes it really hard to write plausible H/D. And yet my desire to do it remains. It's like... a catch 22. Can't succeed; can't stop trying. Argh.
Still, though, if there's anything I've learned, it's that you can't keep on judging H/D fics on the basis of 'does it prove H/D' & retain yoursanity equilibrium (in my personal experience... ahem), because if that's my criteria (and I often slip & let it be), then there -is- no H/D fic I find 'in character' in that sense. No H/D fic fully satisfies the 'prove that canon Harry can 100% plausibly love Draco' requirement. I mean... it's still the ideal, but it can't be the point of reading H/D. Or if you want to read that, there's a very limited scope available to you, mostly pre-slash and fics which are dysfunctional and dystopic in some way. Among the more optimistic/brighter scenarios that are fully plausible in terms of remaining emotional baggage... well.... Basically, why pick on UL when you can pick on (nearly) every single other H/D fic out there?
I think my problem is that ideally, I want to write (and read) H/D for the non-believers. I started out in fandom (pre-OoTP!) wanting to write a novel called `One Good Reason'-- and that's one good reason for Harry to love Draco. And obviously I haven't even come close after 3 years, and yeah, that really gets to me sometimes.
I mean, bottom line, love is irrational. Any attempt to make it totally 'plausible' and 'rational' is necessarily going to fail. I mean, the whole thing was basically doomed from the start (kind of like Harry & Draco).
In a way, it's sort of a philosophical conundrum on the level of 'prove to me that we exist'. I mean, you can strongly suggest that we do, and even why we do, but in the end we'll always come to those basic givens, those axioms which cannot be broken down or analyzed further, only believed. One = 1. Either you believe it or you don't. And I think pretty much all love is as impossible and axiomatic as Harry♥Draco, and that's why I both yearn to see them 'proven' to the non-believers and why I think it's no different from any other love-story.
Anyway, little to nothing about this really has to do with UL, which I love while acknowledging its flaws, which it shares with probably 97% of even the best H/D fanfic. It should probably tell me all I need to know that the person making the above claim about H/D itself being OOC describes himself as being 'sworn to defend Lucius Malfoy' from anything at all. It's these sort of people that make me wary of rah-rah-Slytherin fans, I swear. I guess that goes for the coo-coo population in any sub-fandom.
Perhaps my whole quest to write H/D for the non-believers was flawed to start with because a lot of times it's not that people are waiting to believe a good enough reason, it's that they'd usually refuse to acknowledge a good reason if that means they were wrong.
And of course I want to somehow reach those people, 'cause I'm pretty sure both Harry & Draco are closed-minded like that, at least about each other. Hello, dysfunction! Settle in, why don't you.
~~
In the Good News Dept: I saw Batman Begins last night, and it was just as good as everyone's been implying.
Christian Bale was startling and the whole thing was wonderfully psychological and plausible, as well as totally thrillerish. The only weird thing was the Doctor/Scarecrow, who was way too pretty & gay for me to buy into his evil ways or whatever. He was such a red herring, and just... I kept staring at his lips (well, he kept pursing them!) It was distracting, dammit.
Anyway, all the small roles were wonderfully realized, and the only one I was really annoyed by to any significant degree was the Love Interest DA Lady, mostly 'cause... well, Mary Suish much? Man. Grow a flaw, girl.
I really liked all the different shadings of grey (truly amazing for a superhero movie, though particularly fitting for Batman-- finally). The 'lawful good becomes equivalent to lawful evil' thing is pretty common in anime, but in America it's ridiculously rare, and I just eat it right up. I love the idea of there -having- to be an 'anti' to the 'hero' for the hero to be really 'pure', contradictory as it sounds, because it encompasses the whole Eastern idea of balance I think is so essential for healthy ethics. Come to think of it, it'd be interesting to see Japanese commentary on the Batman phenomenon in general.
Upon reflection & some consultation, I realized the head evil-guy (reeeally bad with names) is Oh So Gay (even moreso than Scarecrow, who's... well), which amuses me. Though I am now pondering whethere you can -always- say the Head Villain Guy is gay for the Hero is some meta sense at least (I'm serious!) Like, I wouldn't necessarily say Main Sidekick Guy has to be gay for the Hero 'cause... I refuse to diss friendship like dat, man, but.... I really think hateful obsession can be a form of... uh, sexual attraction if not love (well, definitely not love). Maybe this takes a certain slant/vision of attraction/love. That said, name me the heroic 'verse where there's no halfway plausible Hero/Villain slash-- go on, I dare ya. I can't think of any, I really can't.
And the Joker bit at the end just made me squeal, I swear to god. That was such beautiful foreshadowing/fan-service, I just can't take it. So cute. Wheeee!
...I'm sure I had other thoughts, but....
Oh yeah, heheh. Baby!Bruce was way too adorable for words. I sort of squealed when I first saw him. Heeee!
Though I really didn't like Batman!Bruce so much. Like, I liked Bruce's thinking 'as' Batman, but not his actual hijinks-- the voice (too low/croaky), the car (those tires are -really- distracting & the whole submarine/rocket feel wasn't... I dunno, elegant enough for me), the moves (not really natural-seeming)-- while they seemed to 'fit' in the movie, they didn't seem Batman-cool and/or graceful or something. Not that most Batmans really gave me that impression. Maybe comic!Batman is really too cool for any actor's britches. I mean, he -is- a Legend. *smirks*
In 'other' news, when I saw the GoF movie promo poster in the theater, I just squealed and cooed and had to touch it. Repeatedly.
OMG HARRY!!!1 Looking all heroic and woobie and... *cries, is dork*
It astounds me how anyone can find Harry falling in LOVE with Draco Malfoy isn't OOC.
It also astounds me how anyone can find Draco falling in LOVE with Potter isn't OOC as well.
...Mostly because I always fall for that 'rationalize your faith' straw man argument, nearly always made not by pairing agnostics (so to speak), whom I respect greatly and want to be somehow validated by, but by people with their own hidden agenda. It just really annoys me that people question concepts which -should- be questioned, but nearly always in the service of opposing bias. It's just one of those things which erodes my respect for people in general.
However, I have to say that's at least 70% of why I ship them so hard. I mean, there are other reasons, obviously, but the sheer impossibility is what I adore the most. So it hits really close to home when someone says 'why does Harry bother loving Draco' when he already does and Draco's already lovable, because, well, we're always going to go back to Harry's base disgust with Draco, and being way too in touch with my Harry muse, this sort of attitude drives me up the wall. And makes it really hard to write plausible H/D. And yet my desire to do it remains. It's like... a catch 22. Can't succeed; can't stop trying. Argh.
Still, though, if there's anything I've learned, it's that you can't keep on judging H/D fics on the basis of 'does it prove H/D' & retain your
I think my problem is that ideally, I want to write (and read) H/D for the non-believers. I started out in fandom (pre-OoTP!) wanting to write a novel called `One Good Reason'-- and that's one good reason for Harry to love Draco. And obviously I haven't even come close after 3 years, and yeah, that really gets to me sometimes.
I mean, bottom line, love is irrational. Any attempt to make it totally 'plausible' and 'rational' is necessarily going to fail. I mean, the whole thing was basically doomed from the start (kind of like Harry & Draco).
In a way, it's sort of a philosophical conundrum on the level of 'prove to me that we exist'. I mean, you can strongly suggest that we do, and even why we do, but in the end we'll always come to those basic givens, those axioms which cannot be broken down or analyzed further, only believed. One = 1. Either you believe it or you don't. And I think pretty much all love is as impossible and axiomatic as Harry♥Draco, and that's why I both yearn to see them 'proven' to the non-believers and why I think it's no different from any other love-story.
Anyway, little to nothing about this really has to do with UL, which I love while acknowledging its flaws, which it shares with probably 97% of even the best H/D fanfic. It should probably tell me all I need to know that the person making the above claim about H/D itself being OOC describes himself as being 'sworn to defend Lucius Malfoy' from anything at all. It's these sort of people that make me wary of rah-rah-Slytherin fans, I swear. I guess that goes for the coo-coo population in any sub-fandom.
Perhaps my whole quest to write H/D for the non-believers was flawed to start with because a lot of times it's not that people are waiting to believe a good enough reason, it's that they'd usually refuse to acknowledge a good reason if that means they were wrong.
And of course I want to somehow reach those people, 'cause I'm pretty sure both Harry & Draco are closed-minded like that, at least about each other. Hello, dysfunction! Settle in, why don't you.
~~
In the Good News Dept: I saw Batman Begins last night, and it was just as good as everyone's been implying.
Christian Bale was startling and the whole thing was wonderfully psychological and plausible, as well as totally thrillerish. The only weird thing was the Doctor/Scarecrow, who was way too pretty & gay for me to buy into his evil ways or whatever. He was such a red herring, and just... I kept staring at his lips (well, he kept pursing them!) It was distracting, dammit.
Anyway, all the small roles were wonderfully realized, and the only one I was really annoyed by to any significant degree was the Love Interest DA Lady, mostly 'cause... well, Mary Suish much? Man. Grow a flaw, girl.
I really liked all the different shadings of grey (truly amazing for a superhero movie, though particularly fitting for Batman-- finally). The 'lawful good becomes equivalent to lawful evil' thing is pretty common in anime, but in America it's ridiculously rare, and I just eat it right up. I love the idea of there -having- to be an 'anti' to the 'hero' for the hero to be really 'pure', contradictory as it sounds, because it encompasses the whole Eastern idea of balance I think is so essential for healthy ethics. Come to think of it, it'd be interesting to see Japanese commentary on the Batman phenomenon in general.
Upon reflection & some consultation, I realized the head evil-guy (reeeally bad with names) is Oh So Gay (even moreso than Scarecrow, who's... well), which amuses me. Though I am now pondering whethere you can -always- say the Head Villain Guy is gay for the Hero is some meta sense at least (I'm serious!) Like, I wouldn't necessarily say Main Sidekick Guy has to be gay for the Hero 'cause... I refuse to diss friendship like dat, man, but.... I really think hateful obsession can be a form of... uh, sexual attraction if not love (well, definitely not love). Maybe this takes a certain slant/vision of attraction/love. That said, name me the heroic 'verse where there's no halfway plausible Hero/Villain slash-- go on, I dare ya. I can't think of any, I really can't.
And the Joker bit at the end just made me squeal, I swear to god. That was such beautiful foreshadowing/fan-service, I just can't take it. So cute. Wheeee!
...I'm sure I had other thoughts, but....
Oh yeah, heheh. Baby!Bruce was way too adorable for words. I sort of squealed when I first saw him. Heeee!
Though I really didn't like Batman!Bruce so much. Like, I liked Bruce's thinking 'as' Batman, but not his actual hijinks-- the voice (too low/croaky), the car (those tires are -really- distracting & the whole submarine/rocket feel wasn't... I dunno, elegant enough for me), the moves (not really natural-seeming)-- while they seemed to 'fit' in the movie, they didn't seem Batman-cool and/or graceful or something. Not that most Batmans really gave me that impression. Maybe comic!Batman is really too cool for any actor's britches. I mean, he -is- a Legend. *smirks*
In 'other' news, when I saw the GoF movie promo poster in the theater, I just squealed and cooed and had to touch it. Repeatedly.
OMG HARRY!!!1 Looking all heroic and woobie and... *cries, is dork*
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no subject
Date: 2005-07-03 08:23 pm (UTC)...Sometimes I really wonder about myself (...because sustaining an emotionally balanced fictional relationship is probably much more difficult... though I kinda like both). I think in some ways Harry -is- a pushover, but only when he doesn't realize what other people are doing to him (that is, he's dumb). When he finds something's off & people are manipulating him, he's the most stubborn bastard ever. He's kinda contradictory like that :> I think, um... I focus on people's stubborn sides overmuch 'cause I can't help projecting ><;;
Sometimes I think I just revel in the exact opposite things in characters that most people like? But I think I'm so predictable and typical-- I like strong, independent, passionate, conflicted-yet-heroic characters (who doesn't?); it's just that those sort of characters tend to be more difficult to interact with, more touchy, more brooding or repressed or cruel/selfish/insensitive/stubborn/etc, and I like those parts 'cause they make 'em more real to me. I just love that Harry's so stubborn & impossible-- if he was milquetoast, I'd probably have a lot less interest in him; he wouldn't be as -strong-.
So the rawness & anger are just part of that inner passion I love. It could turn to sadness or determination or any form of focus, but it's that intensity I live for as a reader, I guess. So yeah... plot is good, but that's not what I read fanfic for~:))
no subject
Date: 2005-07-03 09:41 pm (UTC)*flails around* I don't know, whenever I'm writing, I get paranoid. It is all I think about anymore! Like, I thought three years of examining them led me to exactly what I want to say. But I'm still working it out, it seems.
That's why I loved your Harry from the Ron/Draco so much, really, because he was so helplessly furious and it was almost ridiculous but it was so Harry, and he's just so. Alive. Maybe. That doesn't do it justice either. But yeah.
no subject
Date: 2005-07-04 03:32 am (UTC)Besides, if I recall correctly you haven't written H/D in ages & nearly gave up on it :D So your Harry has had time to um... germinate & quietly mutate in peace~:) I don't think you do soppy anyway, heheh :D Last I checked, emotional torture was your middle name <3 And y'know, all that without much crying, too :D
I think 'still working it out' is a vital place to be in writing. That's where stuff -happens- & is in flux & growing. But yeah-- alive and like, difficult and ornery and a bitch to write even if you think you've 'got' him-- then he gets away from you. Or me, anyway. Draco's so easy to write and he's also a bastard, but at least he's a -predictable- bastard in terms of how he'll react to things ^^;;
Man, I really am weirdly attached to stubbornly-judgmental!Harry. Possibly everyone hates that in canon & that's why I can't remember anyone really writing him like that (possibly, he's like that when paired with other Gryffindors-- I mean, clearly I wouldn't know, ahahaha... um). Well, he -is- emotional, just not thoughtful. At all.
Poor boy, left his thinking brain in the other bag :D