~~ oh Draco...
Mar. 23rd, 2004 03:42 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
reenkaI swear to god, I just got a review (heh) for `What Everyone Wants to Know' (and I actually am not sure which fic that is, ahahah) in Spanish. Yep. No, I don't know Spanish (well, beyond like, 5 words), but I think I've got the gist of it. That said... what does "que te pasa?.no pongas tantas frases vulgares. J.K.rowling no escribe asi." mean, exactly?? I've a feeling it's not positive ("vulgares" and "no escribe" doesn't sound good) but.... ^^;;
My reaction to seeing the latest JKR interview was largely very positive. In fact, now I'm all excited (again) about book 6, and I can't wait. I can't even believe it, 'cause I'm not necessarily a fan of the books (heh) but... I love the idea of more information. I've grown to love the books 'cause they're so intricately interconnected and subtle in their way, and every time I see an interview, the idea that JKR knows exactly what she's doing gets reinforced. I mean, she definitely has a vision, a Plan, which is a fun thing to watch-- especially if you look at it as a puzzle. It's easy to relax, to trust that she really does know everything there is to know and everything is happening as it should-- as it -has- to. She's like Dumbledore, in a way :>
Also, it helps that aside from Draco, I think my desires for the characters coincide with authorial intent, pretty much, and all the little mysteries and hints are things she's aware of, generally. Like the mirror, like what Hermione and Krum did that summer, like why did Sirius -have- to die, like why did both Harry and Voldemort survive the first time, what's the story with Snape, etc. Even Draco has things planned for him, apparently, which is exciting! Even if the plan is "drag through the mud". At least he'll be visible! (Yep. Expectations? Not high.)
That said, I really feel like I have to dissociate to some extent, when it comes to Draco. It's like... no one is going to get away unscathed, and you can bet everyone's life will suck until the end, but with Draco... it's more of a question of characterization rather than particular unhappy events I'm worried about. I feel like JKR is an event-driven author, in that she's very focused on plot and the characterization is incidental. Mostly, I just have to remember that "my" Draco, the Draco I get in my head through thinking about him and reading about him, is rather subtextual in actuality. What he does often depends on what he -has- to do for one reason or another. That is to say... he's barely -there-, in the books. He's a pretty damn minor character to whom I personally have a disproportionate amount of attachment.... But that doesn't mean I won't freak out if something awful happens to him, if that meant I couldn't write about him outside an AU. *sigh*
I read Sister Magpie's Draco post from a bit ago, too, and realized that maybe I've been too harsh on the ice-prince!Draco characterization. It's true that he doesn't express the full range of all the emotions he must feel, only anger... and though most people don't show them all, generally there's more. I think Draco being someone who's probably not seen a great deal of positive parental attention has something to do with it, as well as him being (an aggressive) boy. The problem isn't seeing him as repressed or arrogant-- it's more the way that somehow seems to make him smooth in fanon. Repression isn't smooth, is it? Most geeks are emotionally repressed, aren't they? Ha. Yeah, Draco's a geek. :D Okay, in my dreams. Not.
I've said before that his "mask" is really another facet of him... and it occurs to me that it's a lot like he's being dissociative. Like... whether it's pride or if he hides them as a defense mechanism... it seems like he's one of those people who are both introverted and extraverted. So maybe the emotions he can't deal with just get shunted to the side-- kept separate. He's being rather passive-aggressive, emotionally-- lashing out, but not directly in response, rather taunting sometimes unrelated people usually about unrelated things. Possibly, his father was originally the figure he just -couldn't fight- but didn't even -want- to on some level-- just wanted attention from-- that set this pattern.
I definitely agree that Draco feels pain the most deeply of all the characters in HP, but I think a lot of that is because he's such a child, really. I don't know if he's masochistic, emotionally-- I think a part of it is that he just can't decide whether he merely wants to fight and hurt back or whether he's so desperate that he'll settle for anything. He just wants, in a very egoistic, simple way. He wants what everyone wants, really, but he's constantly shooting himself in the foot. The purity of this neediness is probably what makes him so vulnerable, so susceptible to pain. He's just rather single-minded, really, the way a young child would be. He won't compromise. He won't quit. If he doesn't get what he wants, he'll just make sure it's undesirable somehow. I have a feeling that any lasting consequences either get forgotten or ignored in the present moment, probably.
I was thinking that Harry is a lot more direct. When encountering trauma or abuse, Harry appears to fight back; he doesn't accept it. He seems to have a very secure ego that he doesn't really question until he hits adolescence. Harry sublimates things too, of course, but he doesn't appear to -need- people like Draco does (or Ron, actually), which gives him quite the advantage. To Harry, "they're" wrong and he's right, and he takes whatever opportunity's there to get back at any tormentor. What I mean is, he's as vindictive as Draco is, but he does it from an emotionally dissociated position. He doesn't really -feel- things besides (righteous) anger for his enemies or tormentors, it seems (thinking of the Dursleys-- his only family for ages-- and even Voldemort). Draco just takes it much more personally, I think; as an attack on his very identity, maybe. Harry's identity is kind of unassuming. He doesn't need to prove himself, I think, to people he doesn't care for to start with.
Hermione has a lot of social issues too, but she seems to have a habit of reinforcing her ego by being better, smarter, untouchable; a perfectionist, basically. Neville and Luna just accept their lot in life, never having much ambition to drive them to fight. Snape, on the other hand, has built a shell around his pain, and his ambitions have been rather ruthlessly channeled into what he can realistically have (not to say he's not bitter, of course). He's much more rational than Draco is about that, I think. He may -want- the same things, but he's much more introspective, and he doesn't necessarily see a way out. Draco doesn't really -think- like that, it appears.
It's really Draco's ambition that probably chafes the most. His vision of what he -should- be (whether natural or instilled by his parents) is so dissonant with who he -is- and what his reality is that it can't help but torment him. Harry, on the other hand, would be only too happy to cut back on the expectations placed on him. Mostly because they haven't been placed by anyone that matters to him, so he never internalized them-- Sirius' and Dumbledore's expectations are rather different, but note how accepting both of them have been. That's probably partly why Dumbledore's manipulation hit him like it did. I know Harry has ambitions, but I don't think they're of a social nature. This is probably the difference in Harry and Draco's styles of leadership-- one is natural and one is a pretty conscious effort. I think Harry wants to interact with people on an individual level, for them to love and want him, to give him whatever parts of his personal history he's been missing.
...And I really need to stop and post this before I write a novel. Eep.
My reaction to seeing the latest JKR interview was largely very positive. In fact, now I'm all excited (again) about book 6, and I can't wait. I can't even believe it, 'cause I'm not necessarily a fan of the books (heh) but... I love the idea of more information. I've grown to love the books 'cause they're so intricately interconnected and subtle in their way, and every time I see an interview, the idea that JKR knows exactly what she's doing gets reinforced. I mean, she definitely has a vision, a Plan, which is a fun thing to watch-- especially if you look at it as a puzzle. It's easy to relax, to trust that she really does know everything there is to know and everything is happening as it should-- as it -has- to. She's like Dumbledore, in a way :>
Also, it helps that aside from Draco, I think my desires for the characters coincide with authorial intent, pretty much, and all the little mysteries and hints are things she's aware of, generally. Like the mirror, like what Hermione and Krum did that summer, like why did Sirius -have- to die, like why did both Harry and Voldemort survive the first time, what's the story with Snape, etc. Even Draco has things planned for him, apparently, which is exciting! Even if the plan is "drag through the mud". At least he'll be visible! (Yep. Expectations? Not high.)
That said, I really feel like I have to dissociate to some extent, when it comes to Draco. It's like... no one is going to get away unscathed, and you can bet everyone's life will suck until the end, but with Draco... it's more of a question of characterization rather than particular unhappy events I'm worried about. I feel like JKR is an event-driven author, in that she's very focused on plot and the characterization is incidental. Mostly, I just have to remember that "my" Draco, the Draco I get in my head through thinking about him and reading about him, is rather subtextual in actuality. What he does often depends on what he -has- to do for one reason or another. That is to say... he's barely -there-, in the books. He's a pretty damn minor character to whom I personally have a disproportionate amount of attachment.... But that doesn't mean I won't freak out if something awful happens to him, if that meant I couldn't write about him outside an AU. *sigh*
I read Sister Magpie's Draco post from a bit ago, too, and realized that maybe I've been too harsh on the ice-prince!Draco characterization. It's true that he doesn't express the full range of all the emotions he must feel, only anger... and though most people don't show them all, generally there's more. I think Draco being someone who's probably not seen a great deal of positive parental attention has something to do with it, as well as him being (an aggressive) boy. The problem isn't seeing him as repressed or arrogant-- it's more the way that somehow seems to make him smooth in fanon. Repression isn't smooth, is it? Most geeks are emotionally repressed, aren't they? Ha. Yeah, Draco's a geek. :D Okay, in my dreams. Not.
I've said before that his "mask" is really another facet of him... and it occurs to me that it's a lot like he's being dissociative. Like... whether it's pride or if he hides them as a defense mechanism... it seems like he's one of those people who are both introverted and extraverted. So maybe the emotions he can't deal with just get shunted to the side-- kept separate. He's being rather passive-aggressive, emotionally-- lashing out, but not directly in response, rather taunting sometimes unrelated people usually about unrelated things. Possibly, his father was originally the figure he just -couldn't fight- but didn't even -want- to on some level-- just wanted attention from-- that set this pattern.
I definitely agree that Draco feels pain the most deeply of all the characters in HP, but I think a lot of that is because he's such a child, really. I don't know if he's masochistic, emotionally-- I think a part of it is that he just can't decide whether he merely wants to fight and hurt back or whether he's so desperate that he'll settle for anything. He just wants, in a very egoistic, simple way. He wants what everyone wants, really, but he's constantly shooting himself in the foot. The purity of this neediness is probably what makes him so vulnerable, so susceptible to pain. He's just rather single-minded, really, the way a young child would be. He won't compromise. He won't quit. If he doesn't get what he wants, he'll just make sure it's undesirable somehow. I have a feeling that any lasting consequences either get forgotten or ignored in the present moment, probably.
I was thinking that Harry is a lot more direct. When encountering trauma or abuse, Harry appears to fight back; he doesn't accept it. He seems to have a very secure ego that he doesn't really question until he hits adolescence. Harry sublimates things too, of course, but he doesn't appear to -need- people like Draco does (or Ron, actually), which gives him quite the advantage. To Harry, "they're" wrong and he's right, and he takes whatever opportunity's there to get back at any tormentor. What I mean is, he's as vindictive as Draco is, but he does it from an emotionally dissociated position. He doesn't really -feel- things besides (righteous) anger for his enemies or tormentors, it seems (thinking of the Dursleys-- his only family for ages-- and even Voldemort). Draco just takes it much more personally, I think; as an attack on his very identity, maybe. Harry's identity is kind of unassuming. He doesn't need to prove himself, I think, to people he doesn't care for to start with.
Hermione has a lot of social issues too, but she seems to have a habit of reinforcing her ego by being better, smarter, untouchable; a perfectionist, basically. Neville and Luna just accept their lot in life, never having much ambition to drive them to fight. Snape, on the other hand, has built a shell around his pain, and his ambitions have been rather ruthlessly channeled into what he can realistically have (not to say he's not bitter, of course). He's much more rational than Draco is about that, I think. He may -want- the same things, but he's much more introspective, and he doesn't necessarily see a way out. Draco doesn't really -think- like that, it appears.
It's really Draco's ambition that probably chafes the most. His vision of what he -should- be (whether natural or instilled by his parents) is so dissonant with who he -is- and what his reality is that it can't help but torment him. Harry, on the other hand, would be only too happy to cut back on the expectations placed on him. Mostly because they haven't been placed by anyone that matters to him, so he never internalized them-- Sirius' and Dumbledore's expectations are rather different, but note how accepting both of them have been. That's probably partly why Dumbledore's manipulation hit him like it did. I know Harry has ambitions, but I don't think they're of a social nature. This is probably the difference in Harry and Draco's styles of leadership-- one is natural and one is a pretty conscious effort. I think Harry wants to interact with people on an individual level, for them to love and want him, to give him whatever parts of his personal history he's been missing.
...And I really need to stop and post this before I write a novel. Eep.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2004-03-23 07:26 am (UTC)Yup. Of course, to me, being like Dumbledore is Not A Good Thing.:-)
I think you've really hit on a huge source of Harry's strength as well as his pain in that he's an outsider. He's *always* been defined that way. He lived in a house with a family where he was an intruder. But what he did have was the fantasy (which in his case was a true fantasy) of parents who loved him. It's that whole fairy tale set-up. The evil stepmother neatly splits the real mother in two, so the kid can continue to adore the mother of infancy who just took care of her needs, but be angry and jealous of the woman married to her father who couldn't possibly be her real mother because she's wicked and disciplines her. As we've seen in the books, Harry may be an orphan but his parents are practically the most present of any in canon--completely focused on him from beyond. Even in OotP Harry deals with the idea of rejecting his father (for disappointing him by being a jerk) rather than his father being uninterested in him.
Draco is completely the opposite. I think Lucius shows contempt to Draco that is related to the Dursleys' contempt of Harry--and by focusing on Draco's letting down his bloodline he almost insinuates he's an outsider in his family as well. But for Draco (and Ron) there's no split between the father and mother he hates and those he loves. He's not an outsider at all--he's completely bound to his clan just as Ron is. There's no hope that he could be something independently--no ugly duckling who just needs to find the swans. So while Harry is the outsider, a role he manages to take some strength from by becoming independent and choosing those people he wants to please and those he doesn't, Draco's more just like the idiot son, I think. For the most part, after all, Harry has chosen wisely the people he wants to please--he chooses based on the people who show him affection or do something for him first.
no subject
Date: 2004-03-23 04:21 pm (UTC)I think more than anything about Dumbledore, that's what's supposed to be reassuring about him-- that he's just an old man who's tired, who sometimes cares too much and who doesn't have many checks and balances on what he does, so he muddles along, really. He's not doing that bad, I don't think, and then there's Harry, who can step in if he really needs to.
I think the people who have the worst issues with Dumbledore just don't see him as realistic-- you know, the benevolent monarch-- but then, Riddle isn't realistic either. They're basically different sides of the same coin, since they're semi-equal in power. Anyway, the author is always going to have total power and almost total knowledge, and it's obviously not really related to good and evil-- it's just theoretical power, kind of pure. I was just comparing her to Dumbledore because of that degree of conscious awareness she has, the way she plans everything out. I dunno if Riddle thinks nearly as hard about the things he does. I mean, there's something he -wants- and he goes after it, he schemes for it, but he doesn't really run through scenarios wholesale. That would be my guess.
Your take on Harry & Draco's opposing relationships with their father figures I agree with completely, of course. I think you've mentioned before, how Harry's all about positive attention and rejecting negative reinforcement and being choosy, while Draco's already all set for a love/hate relationship 'cause he already has one with his father. Even similar rejection/attention issues. It's like, what they expect from relationships is diametrically opposed. Not to say it's incompatible, 'cause I don't know if Draco -wants- the whole mixed signals thing, he's probably just used to it. Though it's interesting, 'cause his parents' flaky attention hasn't resulted in him being off and on himself. Rather the opposite, isn't it?
So maybe in my little fantasy world, he can give Harry just the sort of predictable, steady stream of attention Harry would want/need/expect, and actually, I think Harry would be the flakier one, the one with the periods where he wants to be left alone, when he's distant. Ha. Not that he'd ever go away completely, and Draco's already used to the whole dynamic so maybe he could handle it. Man. I'm so totally going where no part of JKR's mind had gone before ^^;