I know how people get annoyed seeing the same uber-popular fics recced all the time, and oh yeah, I definitely empathize. Except I definitely also get really really irritated seeing the same fics anti-recced, too. It's always the same fanfics, whether they're being bashed or fangirled. It perpetuates the cycle. It spreads the disease, man.
Not to mention! No fic is -that- bad or -that- good. I fail to see why so many intelligent people feel the need to harp on something just because it's popular, whereas lots and lots of other fics are just as bad and most often -worse-. The only difference being that they're not pimped as loudly.
This isn't a phenomenon only seen in fanfic reccing, of course. The most hyped-up movies are also the most trashed ones by the critics. Speaking as someone who sometimes enjoys such movies shamelessly and sometimes hates them and sometimes can't be bothered-- it's kind of embarrassing to call yourself a critic and always descend to this petty bashing of the popular kids. I realize no one -cares- if you don't like some obscure art-house movie. But there's such a thing as a critic's integrity, too.
When people ask me what fics I can't stand, I usually name ones the other person hasn't heard of. Most people haven't read `Perfect Imperfection' or `All Torn Down' or `Ruses'-- but so what? I often think the whole idea of anti-reccing is fishy because it implies the person has read the fic in question beforehand-- otherwise they're not really going to -understand- what the big deal is unless you summarize the fic for them and have them sort of read it vicariously. Overall, it's more useful to generalize the flaws you see and try to promote good writing techniques rather than beat on these few popular stories, whether they're deservedly so or not. Though I admit partly it's just that I -like- IP and feel a tad embarrassed, eheheh.
~~
A few days ago, I was thinking slightly about
isiscolo's post about the necessary exclusivity of recs & the issue of needing to trust the reccer.
I wondered (once again) what exactly my bias is. I never really think about how I'm biased-- I rec mostly as a personal reference to myself, so it's implicit which fics are just "good porn" or "squee" or "deep" or "emotionally impactful". I don't know if that's useful to put next to my recs, though maybe I should. I definitely rec based on emotional reaction (laughter, sadness, pain, wonder, thoughtfulness, stylistic beauty, with style often dominating). It seems to me that any story can be written well or badly, but often enough this doesn't correlate to whether people would want to read it or not. People have their issues they're looking to see explored, types of characterizations they favor, things they notice while reading.
I think a number of people just don't -notice- the things I notice. I mean, I don't really know if/how many people do trust my recs, though I assume a number of people find my opinion valid, otherwise they wouldn't read it. Even so, I think the things I perceive are seen as -interesting- rather than er... evident.
As a writer, I think I tend to write to a certain audience-- all writers do, implicitly. There are certain givens in everyone's writing, unstated but always there. "This is what human beings act like." One might think it's universal, and it might be in a way, but not every writer has the same level and type of understanding of that universal. I tend to intuitively notice the sort of philosophy implied in people's writing-- it's just what comes naturally to me. So some of the thing that really attracts me or annoys me about a story is likely to be that subtle philosophical edge. Everything implies a philosophy of living, even Wal-Mart ads.
In a way, I think it's more interesting to delineate bias than to argue over specific instances in particular fics. Because once I start thinking about particular fics and whether they're good or bad and get into an argument about it, my temper starts to rise. It's very easy to start thinking that people have no taste and that they're just deluded. Most people just don't think about -why- a certain story appeals to them, but breaking it down too much could be counter-productive too, since a good story transcends categories and is just emotionally suited to its "ideal reader".
The thing is, there really isn't any reccer I trust completely. I've never really met someone with the same taste as me, even in the very limited world of H/D fics. I think
eleveninches and I have the closest tastes of anyone else whose recs I've read in the fandom, but that's mostly 'cause she's very selective and generally I can trust her to look at the whole story rather than any particular emotional kink it has. That's usually a good recipe for something I'll enjoy at least on the "oh, good stuff" level if not the squeeing madness level.
That's kind of funny, isn't it? The same people who cry indignantly at IP also rec some of the most bland and boring dreck ever written in the pairing. I mean, just because it doesn't have purple prose or overt symbolism doesn't mean it's subtle and cutting and perfectly balanced by any means. But now I'm just kind of complaining, so I'll stop.
~~
You know how I said I hatehatehate pimping? Well, that's other people's pimping, not my own, ehehehe.
I was feeling all irritated and cranky, and then I stumbled upon one of my favorite HP fanartists-- Syrena Doné of jareth.com & Severus Snape's Slytherin Society. I love her Draco and her Snape. They're so... evil. *cries with joy* There's also this odds n' ends gallery with 'puter-hating!Snape, omg. Hee! I have this... thing against evil!Draco in fanfic but I -love- and adore seeing that awful sneer and the maniacally vicious glint in his eye. It just makes me warm and fuzzy. Her inking style is just so old-fashioned and intricate and the characterization so vivid and canon. Also, bathtub!Snape has my heart.
Not to mention! No fic is -that- bad or -that- good. I fail to see why so many intelligent people feel the need to harp on something just because it's popular, whereas lots and lots of other fics are just as bad and most often -worse-. The only difference being that they're not pimped as loudly.
This isn't a phenomenon only seen in fanfic reccing, of course. The most hyped-up movies are also the most trashed ones by the critics. Speaking as someone who sometimes enjoys such movies shamelessly and sometimes hates them and sometimes can't be bothered-- it's kind of embarrassing to call yourself a critic and always descend to this petty bashing of the popular kids. I realize no one -cares- if you don't like some obscure art-house movie. But there's such a thing as a critic's integrity, too.
When people ask me what fics I can't stand, I usually name ones the other person hasn't heard of. Most people haven't read `Perfect Imperfection' or `All Torn Down' or `Ruses'-- but so what? I often think the whole idea of anti-reccing is fishy because it implies the person has read the fic in question beforehand-- otherwise they're not really going to -understand- what the big deal is unless you summarize the fic for them and have them sort of read it vicariously. Overall, it's more useful to generalize the flaws you see and try to promote good writing techniques rather than beat on these few popular stories, whether they're deservedly so or not. Though I admit partly it's just that I -like- IP and feel a tad embarrassed, eheheh.
~~
A few days ago, I was thinking slightly about
I wondered (once again) what exactly my bias is. I never really think about how I'm biased-- I rec mostly as a personal reference to myself, so it's implicit which fics are just "good porn" or "squee" or "deep" or "emotionally impactful". I don't know if that's useful to put next to my recs, though maybe I should. I definitely rec based on emotional reaction (laughter, sadness, pain, wonder, thoughtfulness, stylistic beauty, with style often dominating). It seems to me that any story can be written well or badly, but often enough this doesn't correlate to whether people would want to read it or not. People have their issues they're looking to see explored, types of characterizations they favor, things they notice while reading.
I think a number of people just don't -notice- the things I notice. I mean, I don't really know if/how many people do trust my recs, though I assume a number of people find my opinion valid, otherwise they wouldn't read it. Even so, I think the things I perceive are seen as -interesting- rather than er... evident.
As a writer, I think I tend to write to a certain audience-- all writers do, implicitly. There are certain givens in everyone's writing, unstated but always there. "This is what human beings act like." One might think it's universal, and it might be in a way, but not every writer has the same level and type of understanding of that universal. I tend to intuitively notice the sort of philosophy implied in people's writing-- it's just what comes naturally to me. So some of the thing that really attracts me or annoys me about a story is likely to be that subtle philosophical edge. Everything implies a philosophy of living, even Wal-Mart ads.
In a way, I think it's more interesting to delineate bias than to argue over specific instances in particular fics. Because once I start thinking about particular fics and whether they're good or bad and get into an argument about it, my temper starts to rise. It's very easy to start thinking that people have no taste and that they're just deluded. Most people just don't think about -why- a certain story appeals to them, but breaking it down too much could be counter-productive too, since a good story transcends categories and is just emotionally suited to its "ideal reader".
The thing is, there really isn't any reccer I trust completely. I've never really met someone with the same taste as me, even in the very limited world of H/D fics. I think
That's kind of funny, isn't it? The same people who cry indignantly at IP also rec some of the most bland and boring dreck ever written in the pairing. I mean, just because it doesn't have purple prose or overt symbolism doesn't mean it's subtle and cutting and perfectly balanced by any means. But now I'm just kind of complaining, so I'll stop.
~~
You know how I said I hatehatehate pimping? Well, that's other people's pimping, not my own, ehehehe.
I was feeling all irritated and cranky, and then I stumbled upon one of my favorite HP fanartists-- Syrena Doné of jareth.com & Severus Snape's Slytherin Society. I love her Draco and her Snape. They're so... evil. *cries with joy* There's also this odds n' ends gallery with 'puter-hating!Snape, omg. Hee! I have this... thing against evil!Draco in fanfic but I -love- and adore seeing that awful sneer and the maniacally vicious glint in his eye. It just makes me warm and fuzzy. Her inking style is just so old-fashioned and intricate and the characterization so vivid and canon. Also, bathtub!Snape has my heart.
no subject
Date: 2003-11-23 02:23 pm (UTC)I've realised over time this is a fandom full of People Trying to Make Themselves Look Cool. Not everyone, admittedly, but there are plenty, and this evokes all sorts of strange behaviour, a lot of which they would never get away with in real life because it is stupid, but the distance inherent in the internet prevents anyone from actually walking over and kicking them in the shins.
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Date: 2003-11-23 02:26 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-11-23 03:07 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-11-23 03:24 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-11-23 03:39 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-11-23 03:41 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-11-23 08:01 pm (UTC)that's a funny thing, 'cause i've never particularly noticed anyone shoving fics down my throat. most people don't really -talk- about fics in the first place. i mean, they talk about bnf's, but not -fics-. all the "talking" i see is usually when someone puts out a new chapter (happens every few months) and then you'll have people squeeing on that person's lj and sometimes saying "OMG NEW CHAPTER" on their own. which isn't exactly a fandom-wide love-fest for that fic or anything.
maybe it's also that i've found all the fics i dig on my own, consciously looking for recs and following links and such. i've never ONCE had a real person rec me a fic. that kind of seems weird to me now, but yeah. people -have- squeed about `transfigurations' when it first came out, but i -still- haven't read it. the squeeing only lasted for a few weeks, and then died away. now people sometimes mention it, but not really enough to get -annoying-, just when they're talking about fics. which isn't often.
i do know what you're saying, mind you. it's just that the people act all "too sophisticated" and "too discriminating" to like the fics in question, and they're being as loud and boisterous as the squeeing masses. and also, it doesn't help that i admire CC & ivy & aja & maya & even rhysenn, as writers. not that i worship their fic, but as a person who thinks of herself as quite discriminating, i can still say that it's not worth getting -that- upset over since none of these fics are really CRAP.
at the heart of it, maybe it's just that -i- like them and don't like to be lumped in with the squeeing plebes? i dunno :>
no subject
Date: 2003-11-23 11:41 pm (UTC)