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reenkaand btw, i'm sorry for that stupid, stupid anonymous-feedback meme. i just really like lists, myself, i didn't have any desire to say anything to anybody that i think they don't know. because obviously, i gush and get enthusiastic freely, it's not like it's a secret if i like your writing ^^
and basically, i probably like you if i like your writing. but like, even if i think i -know- someone likes me, and even if there are a number of entries that -could- be me, i always fixate on the one that makes me feel worst and feel all bad, and now i can't even concentrate on reading fic, or writing, because i feel all wibbly and now there's no good reason. so i'm sorry i wrote the silly meme, because now it's like i perpetuated it. i feel so used, ahahaha.
~~
anyway, reading cassie claire's improv `what-if' DV slash thing on![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
vanityfair's journal, i realized something about myself and my conception of being a `slasher'. i don't feel like i am ever -forcing- or -hoping- for slash, anywhere. if it seems like it shouldn't/wouldn't happen, i don't slash it. to me it defeats the purpose.
not that i have a -purpose- (that sounds sinister), but rather-- i just see it, and i call it as i see it. to me, if i am on the slash bandwagon for a certain pairing, it is because it would be wrong to me if these two characters weren't together. sort of like, instead of being with westley, someone put buttercup with prince humperdink because say, they had this fetish for dark hair, and they simply -hated- westley's blond hair, so they paired buttercup with the prince and made her live happily (or whatever), without westley. it's just wrong, deeply, completely wrong.
the reason i see the Trilogy in a slashy way, is because harry/draco is the most intense and real and emotional thing i can see going on. it -screams- ``meant to be" to me. this isn't me wanting to -change- the text, this is me -reacting- to what really feels like the heart and soul of the the text. so it kind of defeats the point to root for their slashing, as if it's not going to happen. because from what i know of cassie, no amount of rooting is going to sway her, and i'll just feel bad. ok, so maybe it won't happen-- maybe they won't be all-out snogging by the end of the series. but if they're as close as they are, if they're alive, if they went through all these trials and they've found out all these things about themselves and each other-- i can only say, well, give 'em a few months or weeks, and it'll happen. i mean, yes, i think cassie can pull of writing it harry/hermione, but it would still ring false to me on an emotional level, no matter how well-written. soulmates is soulmates and there's just no plot twist you can wind around that. she's the one who wrote them as that. i can only assume she meant it. and i think it's -already- slash, for that reason, actually.
i understand that slash originated as a way to pair characters who'd never be paired in canon, to see subtext and expand on it. sometimes i think i'm not a slasher because of this. if being a slasher means taking text and subverting it, i'm not a slasher. i simply interpret it, just like anybody else. i saw harry/hermione in the first movie-- because it was there, try and argue it. it so -was-. i liked the pairing because i -saw- it, and it was semi-believable. there is only subtext rather than text if you're trying to pretend you know what the author meant-- and how do you know that? how do you know that you're being subversive and not just reacting to what's there? i am not the sort of person, i suppose, who reads/watches things with a great mental distance. i lose myself in the emotions and the worlds i read about. they shape my vision, and define my perspective to a large degree. i have never really felt the need to impose my will on stories. i mean, -why-? if it's a good story, it is whole and right just the way it is, just the way it was written.
this is part of my respect for something as a work of art, i suppose. if i admire it, i admire its structure, how it relates to its differing elements, how its characters interact, how its storylines come together and weave layer upon layer of meaning. i give the author (if i admire them) credit for creating that meaning. it's all a question of paying attention.
this is -not- to say that i don't believe in creative re-interpretation, re-imagining-- i do this all the time, myself, with fairy tales. i let them inspire me, let them intertwine with my own imagination. i create my own meaning.
this is especially easy with really thinly-characterized, semi-defective fics. they practically beg you to use your imagination. ok, but i don't care about those fics, as much. my favorite fics are thick and rich and bursting with meaning. one of the reasons i adore kirk & spock as friends, and can't really think of them as lovers, is because i mostly grew to love them through the commercial fanfic published about them. i never really watched the (thinly-characterized) show much, so i didn't feel the need to fill in the gaps. the books (taken in total) -really- filled out the universe for me-- and they were all genfic. so i just -can't- see them together `that way', really, because that's just not who they -are- to me.
or say, buffy. i know lots of people slash spike with xander or spike with angel, on buffy. well, i can't. the show very clearly characterized spike and buffy and their relationship. it made me care about them, made me want to watch them, inspired me. i actually remember wanting spike & buffy together from the very first episodes where it was at all hinted at-- i've always liked their chemistry. i don't just go for every canon pairing to come along-- i have to like it, it has to capture my imagination. for example, buffy/angel is canon, but does nothing for me.
i -have- wanted people together who weren't, canonically. the most glaring example is my immediate devotion to mulder/scully. i mean, from the first season, i wanted them together. probably the first show. they were dynamite. i wasn't -imagining- that. they were. they just weren't -involved-, but that didn't matter as much as the chemistry they had. if they didn't have chemistry, or if mulder had more chemistry with skinner, i'd be all about mulder/skinner, although honestly, skinner?? that is a way different show ><;;
so like, it's really not as if i'm `against subtext' and only root for surface chemistry. um. i'd be hard-pressed to think of a time when i've fancied someone secondary to the main characters and/or pairing. hmm. it's just they're usually not -characterized- as much, so they don't seem as interesting. i mean, i'd have to make them up myself, half-way, basically. which, while fun, isn't something i can fall in love with.
so it's not really that i'm even all about harry/draco. it's just how i -see- them. harry has green eyes. he likes quidditch. he is meant for malfoy. that simple. ahahah. or, a non-hp example: tim hunter. the opener. greatest wizard on earth. has issues, likes to travel. wishes he knew who his mother was. he loves molly. or: fox mulder. obsessed with the paranormal. obsessed with his dead sister. never knows when to quit. hard time opening up. loves dana scully.
who we love defines us. who we need, what we want-- it makes us who we are. to me, there's virtually no difference between saying i love fantasy literature, and i love enya, and i loved Idiot Boy From Hell. heh. it's all one and the same-- they're all a part of me, a function of my existence. i can't help but love these things. without them, i wouldn't be the same person. in fact, i believe i would be an almost unrecognizable person.
it's not like i'm trying to be a party-pooper and saying everything has to be Deeply Meaningful. i believe it doesn't -matter- how you approach it, what you meant to make it-- meaning will remain, everywhere, all the time. everything means something, if it happened to you, if it impacted your consciousness.
if i believe in something-- in a love, in a person, in an idea-- it's because it makes sense to me, it's because it flows out of everything i always knew and suspected about them or the world or both. to me, romance is a function of the most basic Self of two people, interacting and creating a sort of magic, a sort of unexplainable connection that is greater than the sum of its parts. if you understand them, you will understand why they love who they love, or why they don't.
now, it's not like i think everyone has only one person they can have this magic with. we all know that there are a number of people we connect with, that we share this inexplicable destinal bond with. many people are beautiful in different ways, and they give us different things, and they make us different people, being with them.
so basically, if i see a different-but-equal connection going, i would root for it, and care about it equally. you then most likely have a threesome, or a foursome-- because if people click that well, they'll probably all be friends together. this is now friendship, because if you know people that mean so much to you, equally much but in different ways-- the dynamic you have with each one in particular changes.
because i think intense passionate love doesn't leave you much room for more than one person. it takes you over, completes you, ravages you, destroys you, remakes you, frees you, gives you wings and cuts your tendons. so were i to accept another person then, it would have to be -afterwards-. one of the people would have to be out of the picture (ie, dead, rejected, something like that).
on the other hand there is, of course, friendship. in this case, -both- of the relationships have to remain friendship-- that is, you will wind up becoming a unit, or at least balanced, somehow. like, kirk-spock-mccoy. like harry-hermione-ron. like dv!harry-draco-hermione. you get the picture. passion gets weeded out, and only the most pure, time-tested, durable love remains. this is not romance.
so anyway.
my original point (heh) was just-- i respond to this passion, within a story. in captivates me, enthralls me, makes me believe in it. i have a weird point of view, with slash, because i don't tend to slash a story/series/book i've read the canon of before fanon (one time it happened was with star wars: tpm, and the other time was `fruits basket'). it was usually fanon first-- so to me, first come first served, so to speak. the characters were born this way in my head. the first story i loved, was hooked on, in this fandom, was harry/draco. the next 10 stories were harry/draco. the next 30 stories after that, harry/draco. no wonder my definitions of them are completely intertwined ><;;
i -have- actually slashed things, since-- ie, seen a clip of something and thought, gahd, i wish those two guys would just lick each other. but i mean... i don't usually "know" them, so to speak. it's just the pretty talking.
believing in things is a tricky business. romance, really, is all about belief in something greater-- or just belief in something, period. you can't really rationalize it in the cold light of day. you can't really justify it. it takes a leap of faith. to me, something has to deserve that leap of faith on my part-- to make me breathless, to make me starry-eyed-- to make me a believer. i don't just accept things easily-- oh, i might on a surface level-- i mean, say, every movie i see, really, i just -accept- that these two characters fit together, if they have any chemistry to speak of. but if i'm going to be reading about it, thinking about it-- it has to speak to me on some sort of intensely personal, instinctual level. their stories-- the rhythm of their hearts-- have to resonate within me, create a sort of echo. in a way, i then feel what they feel. i live through them. i -understand- them. this is really why i love romance stories, and always have. they make me feel like i can fly, too. they allow me to imagine all that.
and if this happens, i'm only -listening- to them, i'm not really changing anything. i mean-- in this anime i love, `fruits basket', you have two boys, who used to be great friends, but hate each other now, and are all antagonistic. they both fall for the same girl, who also falls for -them-, but they can't touch her for um... plot-related (magical) reasons. the relationship between one of the boys and the girl is very sweet and believable, and i want them to be together. on the other hand, at the same time, i -adore- the relationship between the boys-- so much chemistry-- and they seem perfect for each other. so i ship both `ships at once. obviously, i'm capable of this~:) ha.
this happens very rarely in stories, though. usually there's something that's much more bright, much more intense, almost blindingly so. this is how i feel about mulder/scully vs mulder/krycek. sure there's some chemistry between mulder/krycek, but it's literally nothing compared to mulder/scully, so it really doesn't matter, to me anyway.
~~
anyway, rant over. and damn, but i have a backlog of fic to read/review ><;; *hides*
hee. *bounces in anticipation of next post being -full- of plebey fic-reviews* or maybe just squeeing about the latest chapter of luw, hehehehe
and basically, i probably like you if i like your writing. but like, even if i think i -know- someone likes me, and even if there are a number of entries that -could- be me, i always fixate on the one that makes me feel worst and feel all bad, and now i can't even concentrate on reading fic, or writing, because i feel all wibbly and now there's no good reason. so i'm sorry i wrote the silly meme, because now it's like i perpetuated it. i feel so used, ahahaha.
~~
anyway, reading cassie claire's improv `what-if' DV slash thing on
vanityfair's journal, i realized something about myself and my conception of being a `slasher'. i don't feel like i am ever -forcing- or -hoping- for slash, anywhere. if it seems like it shouldn't/wouldn't happen, i don't slash it. to me it defeats the purpose.not that i have a -purpose- (that sounds sinister), but rather-- i just see it, and i call it as i see it. to me, if i am on the slash bandwagon for a certain pairing, it is because it would be wrong to me if these two characters weren't together. sort of like, instead of being with westley, someone put buttercup with prince humperdink because say, they had this fetish for dark hair, and they simply -hated- westley's blond hair, so they paired buttercup with the prince and made her live happily (or whatever), without westley. it's just wrong, deeply, completely wrong.
the reason i see the Trilogy in a slashy way, is because harry/draco is the most intense and real and emotional thing i can see going on. it -screams- ``meant to be" to me. this isn't me wanting to -change- the text, this is me -reacting- to what really feels like the heart and soul of the the text. so it kind of defeats the point to root for their slashing, as if it's not going to happen. because from what i know of cassie, no amount of rooting is going to sway her, and i'll just feel bad. ok, so maybe it won't happen-- maybe they won't be all-out snogging by the end of the series. but if they're as close as they are, if they're alive, if they went through all these trials and they've found out all these things about themselves and each other-- i can only say, well, give 'em a few months or weeks, and it'll happen. i mean, yes, i think cassie can pull of writing it harry/hermione, but it would still ring false to me on an emotional level, no matter how well-written. soulmates is soulmates and there's just no plot twist you can wind around that. she's the one who wrote them as that. i can only assume she meant it. and i think it's -already- slash, for that reason, actually.
i understand that slash originated as a way to pair characters who'd never be paired in canon, to see subtext and expand on it. sometimes i think i'm not a slasher because of this. if being a slasher means taking text and subverting it, i'm not a slasher. i simply interpret it, just like anybody else. i saw harry/hermione in the first movie-- because it was there, try and argue it. it so -was-. i liked the pairing because i -saw- it, and it was semi-believable. there is only subtext rather than text if you're trying to pretend you know what the author meant-- and how do you know that? how do you know that you're being subversive and not just reacting to what's there? i am not the sort of person, i suppose, who reads/watches things with a great mental distance. i lose myself in the emotions and the worlds i read about. they shape my vision, and define my perspective to a large degree. i have never really felt the need to impose my will on stories. i mean, -why-? if it's a good story, it is whole and right just the way it is, just the way it was written.
this is part of my respect for something as a work of art, i suppose. if i admire it, i admire its structure, how it relates to its differing elements, how its characters interact, how its storylines come together and weave layer upon layer of meaning. i give the author (if i admire them) credit for creating that meaning. it's all a question of paying attention.
this is -not- to say that i don't believe in creative re-interpretation, re-imagining-- i do this all the time, myself, with fairy tales. i let them inspire me, let them intertwine with my own imagination. i create my own meaning.
this is especially easy with really thinly-characterized, semi-defective fics. they practically beg you to use your imagination. ok, but i don't care about those fics, as much. my favorite fics are thick and rich and bursting with meaning. one of the reasons i adore kirk & spock as friends, and can't really think of them as lovers, is because i mostly grew to love them through the commercial fanfic published about them. i never really watched the (thinly-characterized) show much, so i didn't feel the need to fill in the gaps. the books (taken in total) -really- filled out the universe for me-- and they were all genfic. so i just -can't- see them together `that way', really, because that's just not who they -are- to me.
or say, buffy. i know lots of people slash spike with xander or spike with angel, on buffy. well, i can't. the show very clearly characterized spike and buffy and their relationship. it made me care about them, made me want to watch them, inspired me. i actually remember wanting spike & buffy together from the very first episodes where it was at all hinted at-- i've always liked their chemistry. i don't just go for every canon pairing to come along-- i have to like it, it has to capture my imagination. for example, buffy/angel is canon, but does nothing for me.
i -have- wanted people together who weren't, canonically. the most glaring example is my immediate devotion to mulder/scully. i mean, from the first season, i wanted them together. probably the first show. they were dynamite. i wasn't -imagining- that. they were. they just weren't -involved-, but that didn't matter as much as the chemistry they had. if they didn't have chemistry, or if mulder had more chemistry with skinner, i'd be all about mulder/skinner, although honestly, skinner?? that is a way different show ><;;
so like, it's really not as if i'm `against subtext' and only root for surface chemistry. um. i'd be hard-pressed to think of a time when i've fancied someone secondary to the main characters and/or pairing. hmm. it's just they're usually not -characterized- as much, so they don't seem as interesting. i mean, i'd have to make them up myself, half-way, basically. which, while fun, isn't something i can fall in love with.
so it's not really that i'm even all about harry/draco. it's just how i -see- them. harry has green eyes. he likes quidditch. he is meant for malfoy. that simple. ahahah. or, a non-hp example: tim hunter. the opener. greatest wizard on earth. has issues, likes to travel. wishes he knew who his mother was. he loves molly. or: fox mulder. obsessed with the paranormal. obsessed with his dead sister. never knows when to quit. hard time opening up. loves dana scully.
who we love defines us. who we need, what we want-- it makes us who we are. to me, there's virtually no difference between saying i love fantasy literature, and i love enya, and i loved Idiot Boy From Hell. heh. it's all one and the same-- they're all a part of me, a function of my existence. i can't help but love these things. without them, i wouldn't be the same person. in fact, i believe i would be an almost unrecognizable person.
it's not like i'm trying to be a party-pooper and saying everything has to be Deeply Meaningful. i believe it doesn't -matter- how you approach it, what you meant to make it-- meaning will remain, everywhere, all the time. everything means something, if it happened to you, if it impacted your consciousness.
if i believe in something-- in a love, in a person, in an idea-- it's because it makes sense to me, it's because it flows out of everything i always knew and suspected about them or the world or both. to me, romance is a function of the most basic Self of two people, interacting and creating a sort of magic, a sort of unexplainable connection that is greater than the sum of its parts. if you understand them, you will understand why they love who they love, or why they don't.
now, it's not like i think everyone has only one person they can have this magic with. we all know that there are a number of people we connect with, that we share this inexplicable destinal bond with. many people are beautiful in different ways, and they give us different things, and they make us different people, being with them.
so basically, if i see a different-but-equal connection going, i would root for it, and care about it equally. you then most likely have a threesome, or a foursome-- because if people click that well, they'll probably all be friends together. this is now friendship, because if you know people that mean so much to you, equally much but in different ways-- the dynamic you have with each one in particular changes.
because i think intense passionate love doesn't leave you much room for more than one person. it takes you over, completes you, ravages you, destroys you, remakes you, frees you, gives you wings and cuts your tendons. so were i to accept another person then, it would have to be -afterwards-. one of the people would have to be out of the picture (ie, dead, rejected, something like that).
on the other hand there is, of course, friendship. in this case, -both- of the relationships have to remain friendship-- that is, you will wind up becoming a unit, or at least balanced, somehow. like, kirk-spock-mccoy. like harry-hermione-ron. like dv!harry-draco-hermione. you get the picture. passion gets weeded out, and only the most pure, time-tested, durable love remains. this is not romance.
so anyway.
my original point (heh) was just-- i respond to this passion, within a story. in captivates me, enthralls me, makes me believe in it. i have a weird point of view, with slash, because i don't tend to slash a story/series/book i've read the canon of before fanon (one time it happened was with star wars: tpm, and the other time was `fruits basket'). it was usually fanon first-- so to me, first come first served, so to speak. the characters were born this way in my head. the first story i loved, was hooked on, in this fandom, was harry/draco. the next 10 stories were harry/draco. the next 30 stories after that, harry/draco. no wonder my definitions of them are completely intertwined ><;;
i -have- actually slashed things, since-- ie, seen a clip of something and thought, gahd, i wish those two guys would just lick each other. but i mean... i don't usually "know" them, so to speak. it's just the pretty talking.
believing in things is a tricky business. romance, really, is all about belief in something greater-- or just belief in something, period. you can't really rationalize it in the cold light of day. you can't really justify it. it takes a leap of faith. to me, something has to deserve that leap of faith on my part-- to make me breathless, to make me starry-eyed-- to make me a believer. i don't just accept things easily-- oh, i might on a surface level-- i mean, say, every movie i see, really, i just -accept- that these two characters fit together, if they have any chemistry to speak of. but if i'm going to be reading about it, thinking about it-- it has to speak to me on some sort of intensely personal, instinctual level. their stories-- the rhythm of their hearts-- have to resonate within me, create a sort of echo. in a way, i then feel what they feel. i live through them. i -understand- them. this is really why i love romance stories, and always have. they make me feel like i can fly, too. they allow me to imagine all that.
and if this happens, i'm only -listening- to them, i'm not really changing anything. i mean-- in this anime i love, `fruits basket', you have two boys, who used to be great friends, but hate each other now, and are all antagonistic. they both fall for the same girl, who also falls for -them-, but they can't touch her for um... plot-related (magical) reasons. the relationship between one of the boys and the girl is very sweet and believable, and i want them to be together. on the other hand, at the same time, i -adore- the relationship between the boys-- so much chemistry-- and they seem perfect for each other. so i ship both `ships at once. obviously, i'm capable of this~:) ha.
this happens very rarely in stories, though. usually there's something that's much more bright, much more intense, almost blindingly so. this is how i feel about mulder/scully vs mulder/krycek. sure there's some chemistry between mulder/krycek, but it's literally nothing compared to mulder/scully, so it really doesn't matter, to me anyway.
~~
anyway, rant over. and damn, but i have a backlog of fic to read/review ><;; *hides*
hee. *bounces in anticipation of next post being -full- of plebey fic-reviews* or maybe just squeeing about the latest chapter of luw, hehehehe
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no subject
Date: 2002-12-15 08:12 pm (UTC)you gave me a One Good Reason (heh) one could have to dislike spuffy~:)
i can perfectly understand this. erm. if, say, the show became the `anya and xander show', i'd be bored to tears, and i don't dislike anya or xander separately.
i think i just dig it because i like the messed-up thing they had going in `smashed' and `wrecked' and `once more with feeling'. i freely admit, i saw the violent sex and i was all, `more!!!', heh.
plus i like the pathetic-love thing. yep, this is why i like `the untold want' and `irresistible poison', heheheh
um. but i totally dig how it could be annoying if one didn't get off on the car-crash-luuurve thing~:)