[meh, authorial intent-- or, The Emperor Never Had Any Clothes In The First Place!]

[reenka]

Oh man. You could tell I'd buzz like a bee to honey on this-- but apparently, oulangi's snarky/brutally honest Harry/Snape reviews are getting some more attention now after they'd been recced. And of course, to state my position outright: um, she's like my reccing hero. I wish I could be so carefree, but I seriously couldn't handle the negative/other attention, nor do I want to debate people's fics with them & have them resent me, so I settle for talking in generalities. Hey, works for me! :P
    The actual point here is, apparently, that now the writers themselves have been coming to her journal to explain and 'defend' themselves from her 'charges'.

This is just human-- I mean, if/when I (rarely) get public concrit, if it's at all intelligent, I accept the parts that make sense to me and explain myself with the parts I thought the reader may have been missing-- just not noticing-- in their reading. Even though it does hurt me to get slapped with the 'painful reality: wake the hell up!' sticker-- I take it because I care about my writing and what my readers think. I have feelings, and I care about those of others-- they just aren't paramount. And any degree of crit could never make -me- stop writing H/D because I'm self-aware enough to realize how difficult it was, how far I have to go, etc: basically, because I think it's absolutely vital for a writer to be aware of their own flaws! Essential, really. Otherwise you're pretty much a blind man in a house of mirrors.

    I mean, this isn't about writing for fun vs. writing for-- what-- not!fun, pain&woe. This is about having a grip on reality enough not to make a fool of yourself, to me.
    
Like, I don't want to be the Emperor With No Clothes, prancing around certain I'm dressed in diamonds and silk. You can definitely value people's feelings over truth in terms of phrasing the truth kindly or not bashing people over the head with unwelcome truths-- fine. But if you just don't value truth at all-- you'd have to accept you're setting yourself up to suck without knowing it. And me, I'm not willing to deal with that kind of paranoia, myself.

Anyway, I don't just write for praise and jollies-- I write because I care about what I'm writing, and it's not that I don't have ego. Some things are more important than ego even when you have a lot of it (and I do!) You can't learn to write a bike without skinning your knees, and I don't see how you can keep writing for long without realizing this.
    So yeah, I would -never- tell the reader what to think if I thought they -did- actually read the story I know I wrote, which just reminds me horridly of those Anne Rice wanks where she went on and on about how perfect she was and how every word was meant to be there. (Aaaaand it reminds me of those hopped-up HP fans who scream so loudly about how OMG JKR'S AUTHORIAL INTENT IS SAAAACRID-- yeah, sell me another holy cow why don't you.) That's the worst kind of author entitlement & riding roughshod over the reader, and it just makes me cringe to think it's not crazy Anne Rice-- it's a good portion of us in fandom.

It's such a faulty argument-- a straw-man argument-- to say 'I value feelings over truth' in this reccing-honesty business in the first place, because it makes things so black&white -and- implies anyone who tells the whole truth of what they think anywhere around ickle baby writers is a stone-cold bastard. This is a personality preference-- ie, people who're okay with conflict and people who're not-- not a moral/ethical dilemma, especially not phrased like that. 'Feelings' aren't about ethics-- they're about politeness. So even if oulangi could be seen as 'a bit rude'-- I'm sure she'd agree with that accessment, btw-- that doesn't invalidate her points or 'truth value' in any way, shape or form.
    It also doesn't impact her recs/reviews whether or not she's being 'helpful'. The whole idea that she -should- be helpful is a projection of what someone else values in fandom & she has no obligation to. Like... there's nothing saying you have to be helpful to writers or your crit is meaningless. In the larger academic world of people actually publishing reviews, this would pretty much be a ridiculous approach. And although fandom isn't structured like academia, obviously, there's nothing guaranteeing it can't be or won't be or shouldn't be if a particular person feels like it.

Also, if you have to use meta to "explain" your piece of fanfiction in the first place to any intelligent reader? That's sort of a clue to let you know you didn't do the best job you could have, isn't it? At least, that's been my experience whenever I've seen a writer I know/have read be all 'but you don't understand my GENIUS!'. Yeah, I guess I can't interrogate those texts correctly :>
    Okay, plus I don't understand why this immediately gets into questions of 'who do we write for', as if she's challenging the writer's whole mental/creative structure instead of saying 'this didn't work for me-- meh-- but this did, yaye!'. Of course, when one says 'we' write for unquestioning praise and adoration from rabid fans-- I guess then it becomes clear why this one piece of crit could have such power over one's psyche. I mean, it really -is- like the child pointing out the Emperor Has No Clothes.

I mean, you could say 'this is why I'm writing' all you want, and more power to you-- but as soon as you use it as a defensive tactic, you're screwed. It immediately sounds like sour grapes.
    It's not that I think you shouldn't write Harry/Snape 'lighthearted fluff'-- go and knock yourself out! Just, you know, realize this is (OOC) Harry/Snape you're writing, so people are going to have certain well-placed canonical expectations, like say-- oh-- they hate each other's guts more than anyone else in the world. But what do I know, I just read the books.

...Though the thing that actually gets up my craw about all this is how many people apparently think they're God's gift to fanfiction & anyone who says otherwise is a blasphemous heathen who should be put down a notch or ten. Wow. It's like everyone automatically assumes 'having an ego' (perfectly healthy!) means 'having an entitlement complex' or 'having delusions of grandeur'. o_0
    Eh. I dunno. It's just... you can't be knocked down very far by sudden concrit if you didn't think that highly of your writing in the first place and/or didn't believe every squealing fangirl that was like, OMG UR THE BESTESTTTT OMGGG RITE MOOORE!!1 Because that? Is shameless flattery, and therefore not to be taken seriously, right? That's what I thought.

Comments

[parthenia14.livejournal.com]

I've just read the various things being posted, and - for heaven's SAKE! Is it now illegal to have an opinion about fanfic that you post in your own journal??????

No. Words.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Yeah, ahahah, she's not being helpful enough or nice enough about it, apparently, because there's a Code, didn't you know? And The Code says, 'ye shalt not offend poor ickle writers who think their shit is gold' :D

[likethemodel.livejournal.com]

I understand that people write for their own enjoyment, or for their friends and maybe have no intention of trying to hone their craft or what-not. But if you don't like criticism why post them publicly?

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Eh... that seems like kind of a somewhat separate issue? Because yeah, I agree, but this wasn't 'public criticism', this was just recs-with-caveats, not trying to 'help' or even address the writers' needs one way or the other-- just the readers. It's the -writers- who barged in and started defending their all-mighty 'authorial intent' and how really she didn't understand what they were saying and their fans were why they wrote, etcetc. It's a whole bottle of ego-driven wank. Like, of the 'too much ego' rather than the too-little variety, seems like.

[scoradh.livejournal.com]

I actually wish people would say stuff like that about my fic, so it would equal what I think of it. As it is, I feel like I'm insane and that everyone is lying to me ... so that's nice. Go oulangi. Clean up the world!

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

see, what freaks me out this time isn't how oulangi is/isn't being received ('cause that's typical) but rather realizing so many people have no clue they're not actually fanfic gods. then again, i should just accept that the good writers are always modest :)) or at least not megalomaniac? i don't expect much :>

...but yeah, me too. every time someone's like OMG YOU'RE A GODDESS, I'm like... you don't have to LIE, ahaha -.-

[scoradh.livejournal.com]

Dude. Word.

Well, I'm off to see the PS wizard to dl brushes. I have no idea what I'm doing, which makes it so fun.

[worldserpent.livejournal.com]

This is a personality preference-- ie, people who're okay with conflict and people who're not-- not a moral/ethical dilemma, especially not phrased like that. 'Feelings' aren't about ethics-- they're about politeness.

Word. People are welcome to take issue with anyone's review of their fic, but I wish people would stop complaining about the very act of reviewing. (Obviously a futile statement) Do people have zero idea what concrit really is? It's just blatantly obvious that Oulangi is writing for other readers, not for the writer themselves (concrit). If she were, she'd have already sent it to the writers, not posted them in her own journal.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

I think it's got to do with that sense of entitlement fans seem to have about other fans 'respecting their feelings', which tends to mean anything they want it to mean at any given moment. I think I've seen people actually -say- they write for the blind praise of their devoted fans, which is just... sad. I really can't decide where the megalomania ends and the deep-seated insecurity about their very purpose in life begins, ahhaha.

[oulangi.livejournal.com]

Thank you. Your opinion was refreshing.

Mostly I think this is quite silly.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Hahah, I didn't expect to um... make a stand in this specific case or whatever(?) but this is really a matter of principle for me-- there -are- some of us who value honest feedback out there :)) (Not a lot of us in HP fandom, but...)

[gunderpants.livejournal.com]

Hi. This is smart. Thank you for preserving the last lingering threads of faith in humanity.

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

It's good to see at least one post that's not talking about authors being savaged by the big meanies. :p

I have been writing reviews of fic in my journal for about a year and so far have avoided any wank, thankfully. I just want to talk about fic in the same way I would talk about a film or book. Sure, the author can wish that no one will ever write about their fic in anything less than glowing praise, but I don't see why their wishes should supersede mine, which is basically what these people are saying.

[musesfool.livejournal.com]

Here via metafandom, and I agree with you, though I'd suggest that one problem is the conflation of recs/reviews with feedback and concrit.

The thing is, recs and reviews are *not* for the author, so they don't have to be all helpful and useful to the author. They're for readers, to help readers decide if they want to spend their time reading something. They need to be useful *to readers*. If the author should happen to see the rec, well... I rec with caveats sometimes, and no one's ever complained because I pointed out the author had troubles with punctuation or I thought the ending was a little abrupt. At least, not to me.

Crit, on the other hand, should go to the author. If one is doing constructive criticism, it seems to me it's *meant* for the author and should be directed her way (whether she wants it or not... well, I've been burned on that one in the past, and mostly don't do it anymore). It's a different thing from a review, even a review with caveats or a bad review.

I wish fandom didn't conflate the terms.

[tradescant.livejournal.com]

I'm also here through metafandom, and I have to say that I think you have some good points here. I myself am of the Chickenshit If You Can't Say Anything Nice school of reviewing, but as a reader who's never read comprehensively across fandom, I value people who aren't afraid to post their honest opinions and recs. (Remember S and her reviews? Wow, I miss those.)

Anyway, that's not so much the reason why I'm commenting now. The reason I'm commenting is that I got to this link and was knocked upside the head by a powerful surge of nostalgia. Isn't that weird? I don't think we were ever even on each other's friendslists -- hell, you might not even know who I am -- but suddenly I felt intensely oh-my-god-it's-reena-man-i-missed-her-so-much, and felt I should say so, and say hello.

Hello. :D

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

:D :D :D :D!! HI! Omg, I thought you were gone! For some odd reason I've always thought of you as a part of 'my fandom' (y'know, as opposed to 'the fandom'?) and yet always sort of... figured you were somewhere up there far removed from me, among the heights where the Cool People are :> Possibly I was just always shy -.- But I used to sort of... intermittently stalk your journal & your Harry post is one of my favorites -ever- and I'm all 'Tradescant knows who I am!! omg!!' right now :D hee! So I feel like I missed you too! :D

But um, I'm actually a total wuss in terms of reviewing myself-- I tend to do a lot of gushing and enthusing, and all my sour grapes tend to get sold as 'meta', heh, so mostly it's the principle of the thing.
And I miss S also :( She had that most important component of a reader or reviewer, which is the feeling she -understood- my writing and it connected with her, whatever her opinion wound up being, I think.

[tofty.livejournal.com]

Hahaha, you mean my totally biased, completely unapologetic Love Song to Harry Potter? :D:D That is probably my favorite too, because it's the most honest report of my feelings for the series, and for fanon as well. Unlike most people in my particular circle, I definitely had to back into my meta from my uncritical love, and it felt really good to just say, for once, TO HELL WITH IT OKAY I JUST LIKE HIM.

Anyway, I know exactly what you mean about My Fandom -- and certainly I also felt as though you were part of My Fandom, even though I was always very shy about interacting with people as well. Fandom-at-large has gotten so huge and unwieldy in the past couple of years that more and more I am just not recognizing people who are a part of it, and so it is really, really nice to see a familiar face!

And: ahhh, the cool kids. The cool kids who thought everyone understood their raging self-hatred and feelings of inferiority, when everyone actually just thought they were a bunch of elitist assholes. :/ I don't miss that part of My Fandom, not one bit. But god, I surely do miss my friends. I'm still around on occasion (obviously), though mostly on my personal journal rather than my fandom one; but everyone else, just about, is gone, and sometimes fandom is a lonely place without them.

[tradescant.livejournal.com]

Oops. That was me, on the aforementioned personal journal.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

Yep, that one! I always love it most when meta reminds me why I love the things I love-- 'cause it -should- be about love, I think. I sort of lose that thread in HP fandom a lot, but in smaller fandoms it's a lot more obvious. Like, there's this page in ode to Methos' Boxer Shorts (...there's a Brigade) and they have essays about how anyone who doesn't think Methos is Sex On Legs is clearly a pod-person. Hahah in HP this would inspire wank (omg, oppression of the non-Methos-lovers' povs!!), I'm sure :D

My initial drive to write about anything is love-- which is probably why I bang on about H/D EVEN NOW. I mean... all the rest of the sane people I used to know have stopped-- even Aja, ahahah-- but here I am, mentioning H/D every 3rd-5th post at least on average. I think the day you notice other people's ennui more than your own affection is when fandom really -is- not working anymore, and I've gotten to that point many times & always come back after several months of avoiding everybody and pretending I can ramble on & ignore people. Which isn't actually that hard 'cause so few people comment & most of my friends aren't in HP anymore :>

It really is hard to recognize the majority, though I do know the 'important' people in my pairing and some neighboring slashers-- not that we have BNFs anymore. I hope you didn't think I meant BNFs by 'cool people'-- that was a very subjective judgment on my part, ahahaha. I never saw the elitism so much as I put some of my favorite writers on a bit of a pedestal 'cause I was all starry-eyed and there was so much artful slash around (I just recently reread your one H/D fic! heeee! I have such affection for it 'cause I came across it at a formative time, heh). Now it would be harder 'cause people mostly write PWPs without trying to be pretty while they're at it :D

[filenotch.livejournal.com]

Here through metafandom

Also, if you have to use meta to "explain" your piece of fanfiction in the first place to any intelligent reader? That's sort of a clue to let you know you didn't do the best job you could have, isn't it?

Thank you.

Most of my paid writing is to a panel of reviewers to whom I will never speak. Three people, or fewer, can determine if the project I put three months into writing will be funded. If they didn't understand it, three things may have happened, but number one is that I didn't do my job. (Number two is they read it on the plane and didn't pay much attention, although I try to account for that possibility; and number three is that the funding agency picked a reviewer not competent in the subject area, which happens.)

For me, every criticism, whether work writing, fanfic, or original fic, is an opportunity to learn.