reenka: (he shoots-- he scores!)
[personal profile] reenka
It probably says something about me that most deathfics don't make me cry, and most H/C fics with weepy/needy Harry and/or Draco and/or whoever don't touch me, and most cooing reassurances leave me cold. I don't want a fic to have my favorite boy smothered in affection, and I don't want him taken care of. I don't want him to be painted as a misunderstood darling, and I don't want him to have an easy life, but goddammit, I want someone to treat him right.

What it comes down to, and what's really messed with my fanon/fandom enjoyment after OoTP, is that I can really identify with OoTP!Harry, okay. I mean, more than half the fandom said he was a whiny brat, and the majority of people thought he at least needed a clue or to be smacked around or something, and okay, maybe he does (he definitely does), but this never occurred to me, you see, because I'm right there with him. That's why suddenly dealing with canon became so important to me-- I just fell in love with Harry, and I wanted Draco to want or see or listen to that Harry, you know, the one who has all these issues and projects them all on Draco and ignores Draco and hurts his friends and whines quite a bit and has tantrums and is unreasonable and stubborn and hates his life and wishes out. I wanted fics about that, because... and I didn't quite realize this, I guess, so clearly until now-- I'm not in fandom for porn or for H/D or for Draco anymore, like I was before OoTP-- I'm here for Harry. Porn is what keeps the wheels churning, but I love Harry, love like crazy. No words, even.

I remember devouring short stories about the immediate aftermath of OoTP like mad after the fifth book first came out, and I really hoped someone would write something substantial that harnessed some of that brilliance but then it sort of... dissipated. And I still want more, and more, and more (and there isn't more, really).

So it's really no surprise that [livejournal.com profile] mijan's Stop the world! (I wanna get off.) hit me where it hurts, and yeah okay it made me tear up, too. God. This is what's most vital to me-- this and what happens afterwards. Draco's rage and need to be noticed, to win for the first time, to really come into his own, and Harry's apathy and frustration with everything and basic confusion about what he wants and what he's supposed to do and how to grow up, anyway. And see, Harry needs this, I swear he does, someone to knock some sense into him-- someone to want him and scream at him and not let him get all self-centered and mopey and distant.

People say things like Harry would be too busy with the war for romance, but that's the point, to me: he just wants a normal life. If he stopped feeling like he was 'just Harry' and became a weapon or a soldier, I think he'd totally lose it in some way. See, I think Harry could enjoy Draco being angry and fixated on him, because it's just so... normal and reassuring and it's just between them. Ahhh. I think this fic did a number on me ^^;

Plus, I think this gave me the most brilliant idea for why post-OoTP!Harry actually wants Draco (even though he doesn't) ever: because Draco wants him (...I don't mean sexually!). So simple it's genius, no? :D Okay, actually, I think there's really no other solution, because no matter how cool Draco becomes, Harry'd be like, "uh... next!" because he's Harry and he's that prejudiced/stubborn/mulish (as in, the other popular solution, known as Malfoy's Arse Is So Hot, I Don't Know What Came Over Me™-- depends on Harry suddenly noticing Draco out of the blue, like poof! Malfoy Became Hot!--> yeah right). But! If Draco was uncool enough to be stubborn/crazed/vulnerable at him... he wouldn't know how to respond! IT IS GENIUS I TELL YOU.

Date: 2005-05-20 06:29 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] notrafficlights.livejournal.com
Heh, I know which fic you're gonna like when teh Big Bang opens. >:D Hee hee hee.

Date: 2005-05-20 06:33 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
Oh man. Ahahahah.... um. You -do- know me & [livejournal.com profile] shaggirl like... first came up with/run that challenge with Aja, right?? XD

Date: 2005-05-20 06:36 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] notrafficlights.livejournal.com
Oh, really? So you're running it? *facepalm @ self* Apologies. I'm a retard who can't spell.

Date: 2005-05-20 06:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
Ahaha me & Aja are like... um, the dark horses while Shaggy does most of the uh, work public fronting :> :D :D
I uh, make suggestions and secretly threaten to disqualify people :D :D :D

NOT THAT I WOULD OR ANYTHING EVERYONE KNOWS HOW NICE I AM =;

Date: 2005-05-20 06:45 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] notrafficlights.livejournal.com
HAHA YEAH TOTALLY YOU'RE JUST A BENEVOLENT DICK-TATOR!

Seriously though, are there going to be anymore fics?

Date: 2005-05-20 06:47 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
Heheheh that was so bad. -.- you know I liked it :>
...I think there are like 1 or 2 late entries. Let us hope there'll be more porn deep character development. *waggles eyebrows*

Date: 2005-05-20 06:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] notrafficlights.livejournal.com


I hope there's more fics. More fics are always good.

Date: 2005-05-20 06:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] balfrog.livejournal.com
But of course! the strange logical twist of "find him interesting because he already finds you interesting."

Date: 2005-05-20 06:50 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
Hah yeah! And here 'interesting' is like a metaphor for 'really annoying and needs to be WIPED OFF THE FACE OF THE EARTH-- right after you notice me' :> :>

Date: 2005-05-20 06:52 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] balfrog.livejournal.com
But interest not indifference, yes!

:D

(glees)

BTW, I am the scum who hugely enjoyed your Magick H/D fic yesterday and didn't leave a thank you note.
:(

Date: 2005-05-20 07:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
Wah. Man, indifference from Draco makes my head hurt (and I sort of start snarling quietly at the screen, but that's neither here not there). I know I used that plot-device once, but boy-oh-boy do I hate it. Also, I maintain that it kills H/D right in its tracks, too. Also, what a sad life for poor Draco-boy, without his little obsession to keep him warm at night ^^;

Whee, thank you for telling me! >:D! I'm, er, so surprised but pleased! I've always believed that if just one person liked a fic it was worth posting it :> :>

Date: 2005-05-20 07:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] balfrog.livejournal.com
I should just shut up, but...

For me, Draco can never be indifferent- he'll be the crazy, embarrasingly obsessed one, who just doesn't get that showing all that interest is JUST NOT COOL. And yet... He's the original longing boy, for me.

What killed my H/D for a while was indifferent Harry - only because I could see him going that way (thanks for the BigBang, too). Anger, grief, indifference. Why should he care about Draco (as in notice he's even there)? He's the hero. He's got bigger things to worry about. So in my head, crazy little Draco is jumping up and down, going "look at me! look at me!" and Harry's going "eh~."

But then, yay, we have your ouroboros logic of "Harry looks back because Draco's so crazy obsessed with him all the time." Yay!

Am in the middle of "supposed to be doing something else"- ugh.

Date: 2005-05-20 08:09 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
The Draco indifference is the post-OoTP fanon phenomenon that drives me up the wall, and it's probably a reaction to Harry's indifference-- I mean, 80% of the H/D fics I see lately have Harry pine after Draco and Draco be cool, in-control & oh-so fashionably nonchalant or what have you. But it's just been so painful 'cause it's 100% at odds with their current canon dynamic entirely and so all these fics seem to take place in happy la-la land. It's not just fanon!Draco, like uh, Rhysenn's or something, it's fanon world and that's just too much for me.

It's like, yeah, Draco's the original pining boy to me too-- and the old H/D fics totally played on that and had Draco be uber-obsessive and Harry wasn't nonchalant but he was having to be convinced somehow, usually. *sigh*

But the fic I linked totally made me see that currently, canon!Harry definitely wants to be wanted and needed as himself and not as anyone's leader or messiah or redeemer. That's possibly problematic if you see Draco as needing to be saved by Harry too-- because I don't think Harry would be caught by that idea since he's already got all these other jobs in the queue, so to speak. If Draco's the poor little boy who's just lost his daddy and needs help-- it fails. But if Draco keeps standing up to Harry and demanding his attention and saying fight me, notice me, see me-- then that's something no one else in Harry's life is doing, something that actually gives to Harry even as it's a demand from him. It's giving him the opportunity to just play-- to let his hair down, indulge his most petty/competitive/violent/subconscious impulses, to just react.

In a way, that's always been the journey-- for Harry to really see Draco, and for Draco to stand on his own two feet, it's just gotten harder but simultaneously more important to both of them. Harry needs someone who won't take that crap he dishes out to his friends, who won't be understanding, who won't fall in line, who'll challenge him while being controllable and non-threatening. Ahhh <3<3 And it's not even dysfunctional! Who'd've thunk it? :>

Date: 2005-05-20 08:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] balfrog.livejournal.com
OMG, it's like the dance of the OTPers...

(and I say this because, I'm going , uh-huh- uh-huh, yup yup)
and of COURSE Harry needs someone who won't put up with his shit, and of COURSE it's our obsessive, needy brat, and ....

*frothing*

Am reading that fic now, - was - right before your comment came up.
Strange about the indifferent Dracos- because I thought I pretty much kept up with things, but must be out of the loop. I'd assumed Draco would never really grow up - or only would in those HP post-Hogwarts fics - enough to be indifferent.

Harry, for me, needs the psychological push out of indifference. And hahah. you're so right! [livejournal.com profile] mijan's fic uses an indifferent Harry so well. In a counter rebellion rebellion.

Really, love the fandom for the pr0n, but I'm obsessed with the story of these to getting together- fighting, kicking all the way.

Come to think of it, might be all your fault. hahahhah

Date: 2005-05-20 08:49 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
I think perhaps! Um... what I see as indifferent Draco isn't to some people? Like, I think you've read/liked ATBT, right, and that's prime indifferent!Draco material (or, I think in the first chapter it was something like 'Potter wasn't a big deal, small annoyance', same difference). Granted, I'm very (very! very!) sensitive to this after repeated exposure, and now start to froth at the mouth if I see it. It gets ugly -.- (As you probably know, 'cause I do rant about it on here... a lot...) Basically, any cool self-controlled Draco (after OoTP, because before people like Penelope Z & Olympia & Ivy & Aja & such somehow managed to write Harry-obsessed yet cool-fanon!Draco... which now seems like a faraway sweet dream of uh, florid sentences paradise -.-)

Heheh this central need for an emotional challenger (not physical/magical/special-cool-powers, 'cause uh, Harry's the coolest, everyone knows that... um) to Harry-- that's what puzzles me when H/D shippers also ship stuff like um, Harry/Luna. 'Cause Luna'd be like, 'oh btw, *here's something not-really-related-but-interesting-no-need-to-do-anything-right-now*' and he'd be like 'Ohhh.... yeah... pass the roofie'. Or maybe that's just me. I've gotten off track, haven't I?

I love rebellions stacked on top of each other :D Hee :D I think rebelliousness is actually something Harry & Draco have in common, or at least they bring it out in each other, 'cause dude, dude, Draco needs Harry to rebel against 'cause he doesn't really do a great job with his father, eh.... (My conviction that Harry needs Draco is just entirely eclipsed by how convinced I am that Draco needs Harry. It's hard to pry my mind open on this, it is sad.)

Eee, really? Heheh I'm so... um, proud my obsession is catching ^^;;

Also: your journal is swanky/interesting! Why did I never know this! -.-

Date: 2005-05-20 09:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] balfrog.livejournal.com
Ah yes!
The Second generation of Cool!Dracos... The first generation, maya and rhysenn and the original fanon Draco, yes. That's where I got the impression of all post-OotP Dracos succumbing to loserdom. hahaha (which is what I believe and worship. The loserliness is what I like about him, but I think he's always annoyed my prime beta-lady - the bratty, crass, utterly obnoxious drama-queen attention seeker Draco.)

And the Second gen- ATBT and DSoT, as well as SohW. Yes, very gorgeous Dracos, there. Older though. So I enjoy it.

H/D shippers ship Harry/Luna? wow. I really am not reading properly. I could never read Harry/Ron, but then, I don't think the Harry/Ron folk believe in H/D, so it's consistent.

Always liked the sharper edge of H/D - have only been in the fandom for 2 years now, and think I'll leave when H/D no longer calls out to me.

and

My conviction that Harry needs Draco is just entirely eclipsed by how convinced I am that Draco needs Harry.

Thanks for that (among other things)- the chief beta-lady and the beta boy said the H/D in the latest update I gave them was boring, and I thought, huh, darn, "what should I do?" That gives me another goof-around theme to keep them going.

yay.

And yeah, your "Morning Run" is one of my absolute favorites, so yeah, you sort nurtured my H/D viewpoint.

Uh... the lj.... oops. in the middle of putting together the book meme- so will be all dorky and stoopid come tomorrow.

eeep.

Date: 2005-05-20 09:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
Haha, this gives me the idea of saying I hate fanon!Draco² rather than just fanon!Draco (whom I originally fell in love with)... though most people would cite Maya's as Mach 2, so to speak, 'cause he's not exactly crushing on Harry in most of her fics, so I've always thought her in yet a third category with dorky-cute-snarky-boyish Dracos like Silvia's & Trin's.

The thing that probably gets to be in a lot of the Mach 2 fics is that they do 'explain away' past Draco, usually by saying that Harry wasn't that important. And then I cross my arms and pout, because clearly I am just that mature, but also I can never like a Draco who got over his issues or is actually an attractive, respectable character (or perhaps I can't imagine Harry liking such a person... same difference). Alas. People might accuse Maya's Draco of perfection (unfair bashers!! haha) but he's really such a dork, it's Harry's who's... er... um, strangely smitten. Ahem.

Ahaha, `Morning Run'! Heheh the semi-mushy PWP I wrote just to write bad sex and grabby Harry ^^ It's probably sad that it seems mushy-sweet to me now ^^;
But the dorky cuteness is what I -like-! :D

Date: 2005-05-21 02:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
Omg, I just finished Lucid Dreaming, and--! I love it so! I don't know why I did not notice it before now, except perhaps... I've been reading manga for half a year and such... possibly... and you only published it 2 months ago. I don't feel so bad, but! It is great! Great!

It is so big I have a hard time coherently saying what I liked about it, but you advertised it as a crack-porn serial and that's all a big lie :P So it just caught me unaware how honestly... well, touching and poignant it was, and how I grew to care for both dream!Draco and real!Draco, and your Harry was so... bumbling and well-meaning and scary/crazed/violent/yes at the same time, so it hit me where it hurts (I of the over-identification problems), because of the guilt and.... I thought the violence was really dealt with well, because Harry had to deal with that somehow, had to face it because real!Malfoy actually lets him off the hook even more than dream!Malfoy in some ways 'cause he's less in touch with his emotions & represses more.

I just loved all the magic stuff (omg, weird dream-woman! how often do I enjoy an OC? Not very often!) and the pentagram, it just fit, and Harry's dream-powers make sense given Voldemort, probably, and omg the ending with dream!Draco being born of love, that was brilliant, I swear (wheee, fits canon! Reena happy!); and I especially enjoyed the flow of reality/non-reality (I guess I can see why you'd like the Magick H/D fic, hehe) and dream!Draco's wonder-struck reaction to the real world, and your take on Crabbe & Goyle & Pansy was so IC without developing them to the point where they became 'too Slytherin' or too interesting in an over-elaborate way, if you know what I mean. I love that Pansy. Love, love, though perhaps canon!Pansy isn't that clear-headed (weepy, etc) but I love her this way. And making Goyle loyal-yet-treacherous was just... a stroke of brilliance. I just cared about them all, Ron & Hermione, too. Ahhh, there was never really a moment of dissonance, characterization-wise, and much love for 'madcap' Malfoy, indeed, and for Pansy & Goyle's protective family code and understanding. Much love.

You just managed to mix humor & horror & drama & surrealism so, so well (and uh, there was really not that much porn, btw... just thought I should mention that *coughcough*). I loved how boyish and straight (heeeee!!) Malfoy was (I really think he is... I mean I go on about how gay he is, but I love him boyish/rambunctious with his dirty jokes and fake bright smile because I do love Draco... er, if you know what I mean). I loved how you really followed through on every premise, especially developing the two Dracos-- and it's often too much to expect a fic to develop even one! But you really brought sex-toy!Draco nearly the full route to full humanity, and the ending bit at the Cottage was so bittersweet and ambiguous and nostalgic, ahhh. And I know just what Harry means about the cottage. Maybe all of us childhood-nostalgics/romantics dream of Cottages, I dunno.

I loved the snark between dream!Draco & real!Draco, and how protective Malfoy got, and... just, yeah. I really loved the whole thing (and saw some tense-switch errors in the beginning chapters, in case you're curious). It's a really good story and I really enjoyed it a lot, more seriously than any H/D fic in ages (I hadn't read any chaptered fics in months, but still, this just grabbed me-- just the right mix of personal drama and fantasy/horror and taunts of smut). Yeay.

Date: 2005-05-21 11:10 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] balfrog.livejournal.com
You know what? I've had nice folks say "good story", but this one- I'm printing it out and framing it. And it's from YOU. The person I modeled crazy H/D on.

WOW.

And yeah, I fool around with H/D - it was my little take on, "I really enjoy the silly smutty fanon Dracos (the girly ones, the MPREG ones), but wouldn't canon Draco have a fit if he found out?"

And I like my Slytherins- they're kids, so not so cool and cunning as the Borgias yet, but still, they needed a driving force, and I thought they should care about each other more because everyone hated them. Like I imagine Hufflepuffs would be generally nice and friendly to everyone in school and their own house, but would all go their separate ways, nicely, of course.

I think I grew to really like Harry while I was working this out - started out with "stupid nasty Draco" love, then turned myself around to seeing Harry's way. I shouldn't like him too much. He's getting it too easy right now, and that's not good for the story!

I worried a bit about the violence and horror- it just came out... and it's a bit worse in the sequel. Yes, that's in the works. Because, the first one was posted weekly, and everyone wanted a happy ending, and I promised. And I thought that was sort of happy, but no. People told me they cried.

Damn. Have messed up sense of reality.

So, writing the last 4 chapters of the next one now. I really need a breath of fresh air for the boys - they're sort of getting used to each other and not fighting anymore. Damn.

Thanks for reading. Hope you'll be around for the next bit.
and thanks for checking out the tenses- I wrote that in present tense- and went through switching the whole thing to past tense in two days (just last weekend)- and my eyes were bleeding at the end of it.
:D

Date: 2005-05-23 02:54 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] miss-charmed.livejournal.com
*giggles*
Your love for Harry shines through :D It's affecting! :D

*flails* because that fic rocked my world ♥ It's not even that much H/;D in the smutty, shipping way... but gawd, it made so much sense!

Date: 2005-05-23 03:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yourpoison.livejournal.com
I'm starting to think I find it easiest to ship H/D these days when it's more gen-like, because I'm so tired of the cliches and every characterization inconsistency that gets deemed important so that they get together-- I'd rather not see them 'together' and just interact and be themselves but in each other's general vicinity :> I think in translation, I'm becoming something of a canon-whore ^^;;

Hehe I always go on in rhapsodies about things I love <3

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