Let me just say that I think you're misunderstanding *much* of what I said, admittedly very angrily, to you in my comments.
I generally like to put my opinion out there, say what I have to say one time, and leave it at that. I don't generally like elaboration and discussion, though there have been few exceptions and at times they've happened on your journal. I don't even know how to respond to your comments right now, though, without actually quoting various of your own remarks back to you that you've made at various points in time, and yelling, "SEE, RIGHT THERE? CAN'T YOU SEE HOW PRETENTIOUS AND CONDESCENDING THAT SOUNDS?!"
But I don't really feel like battling LJ's craptastic load times to do that, so I'm instead going to suggest that you carefully read over some of your posts about h/d, shipping, and fandom, that you try and objectively read over them, and try to see how your judgments about the ship come across to many of us. Hell, read your own thread, where you and Malafede debate the demerits of Verdant's writing: Debbie who has been *nothing* but massively supportive and encouraging of you and your fics and your level of discussion ever since you came to the fandom. How can you objectively say that something like this--"Ahhhh, no, don't spoil me, I was really really REALLY HOPING it was at least going to be good. *CRIES* WHY GOD WHY WHY WHY. No, I mean, it's Verdant, can't be that bad. Can it? " --is not in the least condescending??
You're assuming what set me off and made me this angry this morning was my feeling that *I* had been mocked, when really it was just the general outrage that came from seeing you mock Debbie's fic, from seeing you imply that Dorrie's take on H/D is somehow fresher and more immature than yours because you've been reading H/D fics longer (and I'm not saying that's how you intentionally meant it to sound, but that's how it read to me, and it's definitely how it read to her). I wasn't even really *angry* about your comment on fandom_wank; but I was, rather, availing myself of the opportunity to call you a hypocrite, since you had availed yourself of the opportunity to call me an elitist wanker. (And yes, you *did* call me an elitist wanker, since you implied that the members of mockitymock were elitist wankers.)
And you say that you don't mean me, but just "the group" in mockitymock--and that's exactly what you always say, Reena, whenever anybody questions your general views on H/D and shippers by pointing out things that they do directly, things which fall in your stated view of, 'oh, this is bad, this is wrong.' You always respond with some version of, "I didn't mean -you-."
But how can you not see that I am one of the specific group of people you're talking about? How can you not see that if you say "fics containing this (X characteristic) suck," you're also specifically saying that the fics of *people who've written that characteristic* suck? Because regardless of how you mean it, people are going to read your remarks that way--and they do.
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timeasmymeasure
no subject
Date: 2004-06-29 04:52 pm (UTC)I generally like to put my opinion out there, say what I have to say one
time, and leave it at that. I don't generally like elaboration and discussion, though there have been few exceptions and at times they've happened on your journal. I don't even know how to respond to your comments right now, though, without actually quoting various of your own remarks back to you that you've made at various points in time, and yelling, "SEE, RIGHT THERE? CAN'T YOU SEE HOW PRETENTIOUS AND CONDESCENDING THAT SOUNDS?!"
But I don't really feel like battling LJ's craptastic load times to do that, so I'm instead going to suggest that you carefully read over some of your posts about h/d, shipping, and fandom, that you try and objectively read over them, and try to see how your judgments about the ship come across to many of us. Hell, read your own thread, where you and Malafede debate the demerits of Verdant's writing: Debbie who has been *nothing* but massively supportive and encouraging of you and your fics and your level of discussion ever since you came to the fandom. How can you objectively say that something like this--"Ahhhh, no, don't spoil me, I was really really REALLY HOPING it was at least going to be good. *CRIES* WHY GOD WHY WHY WHY. No, I mean, it's Verdant, can't be that bad. Can it? " --is not in the least condescending??
You're assuming what set me off and made me this angry this morning was my feeling that *I* had been mocked, when really it was just the general outrage that came from seeing you mock Debbie's fic, from seeing you imply that Dorrie's take on H/D is somehow fresher and more immature than yours because you've been reading H/D fics longer (and I'm not saying that's how you intentionally meant it to sound, but that's how it read to me, and it's definitely how it read to her). I wasn't even really *angry* about your comment on fandom_wank; but I was, rather, availing myself of the opportunity to call you a hypocrite, since you had availed yourself of the opportunity to call me an elitist wanker. (And yes, you *did* call me an elitist wanker, since you implied that the members of mockitymock were elitist wankers.)
And you say that you don't mean me, but just "the group" in mockitymock--and that's exactly what you always say, Reena, whenever anybody questions your general views on H/D and shippers by pointing out things that they do directly, things which fall in your stated view of, 'oh, this is bad, this is wrong.' You always respond with some version of, "I didn't mean -you-."
But how can you not see that I am one of the specific group of people you're talking about? How can you not see that if you say "fics containing this (X characteristic) suck," you're also specifically saying that the fics of *people who've written that characteristic* suck? Because regardless of how you mean it, people are going to read your remarks that way--and they do.