~~ elitist but not proud -.-
Apr. 29th, 2003 12:28 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
reenkawondering what the difference is between cultural prejudice and cultural knowledge. at what point does your confidence and tendency to assume become belligerent? does it always have to be an active issue, or can you just passively think certain things that promote misunderstanding and suspicion? can anyone ever be really innocent of all the things people point to as wrong and undesireable? i understand how of -course- everything has to be polarized for clarity to be attained for most people, but these divisions and assumptions that one -can- be pure and "right", sort of bother me.
when people disagree with me, it tends to be categorical-- there's definitely a judgement involved-- this is wrong, i don't agree, your thinking processes are faulty and messed up. and it goes against my nature (i would have assumed) to accept that, and yet most times i do accept that. if you are more logical and more thought out than me, i will accede your point. in a way, this troubles me-- i seem to have a lowered sense of confidence in myself, and that's not a good thing. but anyway, very few people do the same: agree and disagree on a spectrum, agree in certain ways, in certain circumstances, in this light, in that light. everyone is somewhat right, except the people who are completely certain. -i- think.
~~
lately, also, i've been thinking that there seems to be an issue of appropriation with stories-- i remember someone saying they wanted to have the 5th book for themselves and not have it be a fandom-wide event and rather a personal relationship. i miss that, too. on the one hand, i enjoy the communal experience, but there's a feeling, also, like i'm missing something. having a private relationship, having "the fellow readers" being only theoretical. i realize there are reading circles in real life, but it's not something i ever did. by appropriation i mean-- when i like a story a lot, in a way it becomes my story-- i have a personal relationship with it, in some sort of limited, small little world in my head.
i wonder if there's really some sort of intrinsic loss as well as gain in being in a fandom-- i mean in terms of one's relationship with fanfic as well as the source material. when it's a brilliant, popular story, it becomes public property in fandom. everyone seems to have a piece of it, everyone has a relationship. the story and the author are no longer just mine. i don't know what the word is. friend doesn't fit, and yet i do feel affection for both if i really enjoyed it.
a part of sharing love for things is definitely joy. but-- sometimes my happiness feels worn by encountering hype & mass hysteria and adoration. i dunno, it makes it feel cheaper, somewhat. my own experience seems less unique, less vital, in retrospect-- even though i know this is just an illusion, really. (and here is where it becomes obvious that i'm a lurker by nature, and it's only my inability to shut up that prevents it from happening.) private adoration is really rather a different sort of experience than public adoration of the same story. sometimes i think this publicness ruins, or rather, shifts some aspect of my innate response to stories.
i think this is related to the difference between mass squeeing and discussion. if i discussed a story with people, we can share and express ourselves and be mutual. but the squeeing and the "omg, i'm sososo dead" and the insane wailing and such seems to just remind me of the latest blockbuster.
obviously, a lot of people have a personal relationship with say, star wars even though it's a huge phenomenon, and people actually bond over it. but they bond over it -later-. most of the fans fell in love before there was any huge culture of it. they were kids, and the biggest culture was probably a few of their best friends who watched it with them. and the majority of people who are huge fans of `the matrix' or something don't really seem sentimental or emotional about it. it's just something they enjoy.
i don't know. it just becomes most obvious when things become hyped before one even has the chance to read them at all and form one's own opinion. my natural impulse now is to resist. i mean, this doesn't actually affect my opinion-- if something's insanely popular, i don't dislike it when i read it just because of that. it just makes me less likely to read it. i mean-- i read all the "big wip's" in h/d before i knew what the mass opinion of them was. i didn't know much beyond them being recced. i didn't know they were "big names" or anything. i just read them.
a lot of people stop reading fic after awhile in one fandom, so this isn't an issue. they have this rush of fic reading where it's indiscriminate-- then they progress to only really reading fic by their friends-- and then they barely read anything unless it makes a -really- big splash or it's by the few of their friends who actually still -write- fic in that same fandom. this is my impression anyway.
the truth is, i will go once i've read all the h/d i could stand. i mean, reading is a huge part of my life and always has been, so the natural progression of newbie to old fandom geezer doesn't affect me so much. i'm too hard-core (hard-core pathetic) or something. but anyway. i was just mourning the fact that it's gotten to this point. where the vocalness of other people is affecting my potential enjoyment of fic. i mean, reccing is one thing, and obviously it's a good thing as far as i'm concerned. but in a way, it's almost like it's less of a choice, less of a personal relationship if i read a fic that's widely recced by well-known fans. it's like i'm reading the latest best-seller -because- it's a best-seller and not because it just looked good. and yah, this is why i didn't read the hp books when they came out (well, there were other reasons, but we won't mention them). anyway.
i'm done now.
~~
unrelatedly: wheee! i *heart* my icon >:D<
EDIT - compulsively reccing things. but. this has got to be the trippiest tom riddle picture ever. and that girl who drew the anti-h/d pic i linked to awhile ago (melissa miller) still draws amazing slytherins. wheee, evil!draco, how i lurrve thee.
when people disagree with me, it tends to be categorical-- there's definitely a judgement involved-- this is wrong, i don't agree, your thinking processes are faulty and messed up. and it goes against my nature (i would have assumed) to accept that, and yet most times i do accept that. if you are more logical and more thought out than me, i will accede your point. in a way, this troubles me-- i seem to have a lowered sense of confidence in myself, and that's not a good thing. but anyway, very few people do the same: agree and disagree on a spectrum, agree in certain ways, in certain circumstances, in this light, in that light. everyone is somewhat right, except the people who are completely certain. -i- think.
~~
lately, also, i've been thinking that there seems to be an issue of appropriation with stories-- i remember someone saying they wanted to have the 5th book for themselves and not have it be a fandom-wide event and rather a personal relationship. i miss that, too. on the one hand, i enjoy the communal experience, but there's a feeling, also, like i'm missing something. having a private relationship, having "the fellow readers" being only theoretical. i realize there are reading circles in real life, but it's not something i ever did. by appropriation i mean-- when i like a story a lot, in a way it becomes my story-- i have a personal relationship with it, in some sort of limited, small little world in my head.
i wonder if there's really some sort of intrinsic loss as well as gain in being in a fandom-- i mean in terms of one's relationship with fanfic as well as the source material. when it's a brilliant, popular story, it becomes public property in fandom. everyone seems to have a piece of it, everyone has a relationship. the story and the author are no longer just mine. i don't know what the word is. friend doesn't fit, and yet i do feel affection for both if i really enjoyed it.
a part of sharing love for things is definitely joy. but-- sometimes my happiness feels worn by encountering hype & mass hysteria and adoration. i dunno, it makes it feel cheaper, somewhat. my own experience seems less unique, less vital, in retrospect-- even though i know this is just an illusion, really. (and here is where it becomes obvious that i'm a lurker by nature, and it's only my inability to shut up that prevents it from happening.) private adoration is really rather a different sort of experience than public adoration of the same story. sometimes i think this publicness ruins, or rather, shifts some aspect of my innate response to stories.
i think this is related to the difference between mass squeeing and discussion. if i discussed a story with people, we can share and express ourselves and be mutual. but the squeeing and the "omg, i'm sososo dead" and the insane wailing and such seems to just remind me of the latest blockbuster.
obviously, a lot of people have a personal relationship with say, star wars even though it's a huge phenomenon, and people actually bond over it. but they bond over it -later-. most of the fans fell in love before there was any huge culture of it. they were kids, and the biggest culture was probably a few of their best friends who watched it with them. and the majority of people who are huge fans of `the matrix' or something don't really seem sentimental or emotional about it. it's just something they enjoy.
i don't know. it just becomes most obvious when things become hyped before one even has the chance to read them at all and form one's own opinion. my natural impulse now is to resist. i mean, this doesn't actually affect my opinion-- if something's insanely popular, i don't dislike it when i read it just because of that. it just makes me less likely to read it. i mean-- i read all the "big wip's" in h/d before i knew what the mass opinion of them was. i didn't know much beyond them being recced. i didn't know they were "big names" or anything. i just read them.
a lot of people stop reading fic after awhile in one fandom, so this isn't an issue. they have this rush of fic reading where it's indiscriminate-- then they progress to only really reading fic by their friends-- and then they barely read anything unless it makes a -really- big splash or it's by the few of their friends who actually still -write- fic in that same fandom. this is my impression anyway.
the truth is, i will go once i've read all the h/d i could stand. i mean, reading is a huge part of my life and always has been, so the natural progression of newbie to old fandom geezer doesn't affect me so much. i'm too hard-core (hard-core pathetic) or something. but anyway. i was just mourning the fact that it's gotten to this point. where the vocalness of other people is affecting my potential enjoyment of fic. i mean, reccing is one thing, and obviously it's a good thing as far as i'm concerned. but in a way, it's almost like it's less of a choice, less of a personal relationship if i read a fic that's widely recced by well-known fans. it's like i'm reading the latest best-seller -because- it's a best-seller and not because it just looked good. and yah, this is why i didn't read the hp books when they came out (well, there were other reasons, but we won't mention them). anyway.
i'm done now.
~~
unrelatedly: wheee! i *heart* my icon >:D<
EDIT - compulsively reccing things. but. this has got to be the trippiest tom riddle picture ever. and that girl who drew the anti-h/d pic i linked to awhile ago (melissa miller) still draws amazing slytherins. wheee, evil!draco, how i lurrve thee.
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no subject
Date: 2003-04-29 02:22 pm (UTC)I know what you mean about hype-backlash. I held off on reading Harry Potter for quite some time, mostly out of that contrary impulse. In a way I'm glad I did, because now I can say I don't think they're the greatest thing since Alice In Wonderland and not everyone will look at me like I'm tripping -- the initial glamor's worn off.
if you are more logical and more thought out than me, i will accede your point. in a way, this troubles me-- i seem to have a lowered sense of confidence in myself
Well, you know yourself infinitely better than I do :) But I don't think that necessarily follows. It sounds to me more like being sensible. Self-confidence is a grand thing, but not when it keeps you from ever changing your mind...
a lot of people stop reading fic after awhile in one fandom, so this isn't an issue. they have this rush of fic reading where it's indiscriminate-- then they progress to only really reading fic by their friends-- and then they barely read anything unless it makes a -really- big splash or it's by the few of their friends who actually still -write- fic in that same fandom. this is my impression anyway.
Hmm. For me, at least, it's not so much that I read less, after entirely too many years in my weird little fandom, but that I enjoy less, in approximately that progression. There was that first gosh-wow period where I was just so excited that people wrote the stuff at all -- and then I got jaded, and I don't necessarily read any less, but a lot of it bores and/or revolts me.
On the other hand, my fandom is smallish and obscure, so I'm never sure if I'm a valid example for any given fannish theory. :)
Interesting stuff, anyway.
no subject
Date: 2003-04-29 03:36 pm (UTC)it's a weird thing, actually getting proof that all sorts of people i don't know about read this stuff. like, maybe it's just that i have such a large friends list, i have no time to read random people, but i do remember way back in the beginning when i'd read others' friends lists and stuff.
but er. i suppose i meant-- i see it chronically-- i keep backing down whenever someone disagrees. on the one hand, i'm just reasonable, but on the other hand, i'm tired of always questioning myself. it just seems too easy, i guess. then again, i haven't had the experience of really dumb people arguing with me, so maybe there are limits ^^;
hee. it seems that i've always spotted bad fic. it was always there. and it's still there. and the brilliant stuff is still there too. but then, this is a huge, huge fandom. 'course, there's no way i'd be in a small fandom, simply 'cause there wouldn't be enough selection to keep my interest. with hp, there is sooooo much new fic, and it's produced all the time, that there's even too much of the -good- fic to keep up with. i mean, a lot of it's works in progress, but still~:)
and eh. the truth is, without fanfic, i'd probably never have read the books. i really did have a strong negative reaction to jkr's style. no need to torture myself ><;
but then, i still read mercedes lackey, and i don't have -any- excuse there. i mean, really.
but anyway. er. thanks for responding. a part of the lack of self-confidence is that if -no one- responds, i tend to wonder if i was really -really- stupid this time ~:)
~reena