~~ficlet. `telling ron'.

[reenka]

so, i've finally read one too many fics with the most awkward, stupid way of coming out that i could imagine, short of giving someone a version of the birds and the bees speech. my god, every time i read one of these, they make me cringe. for one thing, harry potter wouldn't even -know- words like gay, or `bi' especially. even if he -did- know the word gay, i sincerely doubt he'd apply it to himself, immediately or at first, anyway. it always sounds forced and politically correct and neat-and-tidy, and entirely false.

"hello, i'm gay and i will now act all educated and enlightened, and accept myself for who i am." or, "hello, i'm gay and it's wrong and i hate myself."

these are both attitudes of people who've grown up in the modern-day western culture. harry didn't, not quite. and most especially ron and draco didn't. harry's teenage and pre-teen years were spent with a peer-group who mostly don't interact with the modern western culture where these concepts are commonplace. having them use them in conversation sounds forced to me. in fact, the whole "coming out" conversation sounds wrong to me most times. it almost always sounds like the author is telling us what they think about the character's orientation, rather than letting the character tell us what they think of themselves and their emotions-- which is most likely a jumble of confused ideas and misinformation and denial and awkwardness.

i sincerely doubt, also, that there are books about any of this in the library-- muggle psychology is one thing (even that i find iffy), the most recent and up-to-date, sexually permissive muggle psych theory is another. my impression is that hogwarts has a -magical- library, mostly anyway. if they did have muggle-type literature, it'd probably be really old and outdated. this is a school, not a high-level muggle research facility. but whatever.

i was inspired to write something, to challenge myself to sound less dorky myself, if i could. i don't know if i succeeded. in fact, writing ron in -any- context has never been a piece of cake for me (this is probably 90% of why i ship neither harry/ron nor draco/ron-- i couldn't write ron to save my life). so, this isn't really all that ron-like. but at least it's not what you normally come across. i -think-.



disclaimer: not mine.

warning: slash, dorkiness, fluff, slight language.

a/n: this is my take on trying to do in-character!Harry coming out. I probably suck but... not as bad as I could, I hope.


-Telling Ron-


"Hey Harry, you know you can tell me."

"Tell you what?"

"Hermione told me you have something to say, but I was going to have to convince you. She was rather vague." Smirking. "So, what is it? Trust me, whatever it is, it can't be any weirder than the theories I've come up with already."

"Well, I don't know if I know what there is to tell yet, actually."

"Aw, come on, that just makes me more curious. Spill!"

"You're going to think I've lost it. You might be right. Maybe it'll go away by tomorrow for all I know, and then there really -won't- be anything to tell."

"Harry, you're not-- you're not saying you're -scared- to tell me something, are you mate?"

"Er-- scared? I-- Well-- I just--"

"You're not even scared of Voldemort, Harry!"

"What makes you think -that-? Of course I am."

"Well okay, I was just saying that. Still. This is me, Harry. We've always told each other everything important, right? Er, except for those times when we didn't."

Mutual laughter.

"So, I mean--

"What makes you think this is important?"

"The amount of trouble I'm having getting you to own up to whatever it is, for one thing." Snickering. "It can't be that bad. I mean, I know about the time you got caught wanking by Madam Pomfrey and I only tease you about it once a month or so, tops."

"You're not helping."

"Sorry. But you know what I mean. I am the best secret keeper since Sigmund the Slow got cursed by his wife to never use the words `baby', `tail', and `devil' in conversation ever again. Better, even."

"It's not about secrets, Ron. It's just that if I were you, I don't think I'd want to know, that's all."

"Bollocks. You can't know something like that. You can't know whether or not I'd want to know. I'm not you, you know."

Sighing. "Yeah, and that's why you wouldn't want to know. Hell, sometimes I think -I- don't want to know."

"You don't know that, Harry." Chuckling. "C'mon, it can't be that bad.... You can't possibly tell me it's worse than the stuff about Voldemort. Or Madam Pomfrey. Or the time Malfoy bit your ear off."

"Yes, it can! And hey! That never happened!" Heavy blushing.

"Easy, there. Yeah, I know, I was just teasing. Come on, it'll just get worse if you don't tell me. I can start with the Snape jokes, and neither of us wants that, do we Harry."

"Argh! This is so frustrating! Fine!" A deep breath. "Ilikeboys." Mumbling.

"Huh?"

"I. Like. Boys, Ron." A resentful look. "See? I told you. Now you're sorry, aren't you."

"What-- what do you mean? I like boys too, mate. Us men, we've got to stick together, you know." A forced-looking smile. "At least that's what I hear Hermione tell Ginny lately, except she says women."

Glaring.

"But that's not what you meant, is it." Quietly.

"What in bloody hell do you -think- I mean? I don't really know what it means, it's just, you know like with Cho? Well... I guess what I mean is... it's not that I like boys, exactly. I just like one. Er... you know. Boy. So far anyway." Looking down.

"So that's-- that's it?"

"Yeah."

"So...."

"Yeah." A deep sigh. "I can go now, if you want. For a walk, I mean. Or something like that."

"No! I mean... er... okay, you've got me there, Harry. I don't know what to say...."

"Yeah."

"But, um.... that, um.... doesn't mean you like -me-, does it?" Blushing.

Head snapping up. "No! God, Ron! You're my best mate. That's-- that's--" Horrified expression.

Mutual staring, then a sudden burst of laughter.

"Hah. Yeah, that -would- be pretty twisted, wouldn't it, Harry." More laughter. "So...." An awkward pause. "Do I want to know who this boy is, then?"

"Er. -No-." Emphatically.

"Oh. Right. Okay. One thing at a time, I guess, eh Harry?"

A tentative smile. "Yeah, I guess so."

"So then... do you still like girls then?"

"Why?"

"Just curious, that's all."

"Er... well... I -think- so. I mean, yeah."

"That's good. I mean, er, I mean, so that means...." Furious blushing. "What I'm saying is, you're still our old Harry, right? Except more perverted. Okay, a lot more. And I mean a lot."

Weak laughter. "Last time I checked, yeah."

"Yeah, so, except for the boy thing.... Which I wasn't expecting at all, I'll admit. Okay, so it was a shocker. I think I'm still recovering, though you probably can't tell. I bet I sound completely normal. Which I am. Normal, that is. And I don't really know what it even means, but, er.... I can guess."

"Actually, I don't really know either, Ron."

"Well, I can work with that. I think."

"Oh. Really?"

"Give me time, would you though? You know. Before... before you... you know. Do anything. In front of me, I mean."

Choking sounds. "Ron! It's just a crush! I don't know if I'll ever-- even-- God. I haven't even-- er. You're turning green, Ron."

"Sorry! Sorry, Harry. This is going to just-- take some time, okay?"

"Yeah."

"We're still mates though, don't worry. I mean, you've never tried to sleep in my bed before or anything, so I figure you're not going to start now, right?" Nervous laughter.

"I thought I -told- you!" Indignant look.

"Just making sure." A pause. "So. Now that that's out of the way. How about we finish that chess-game from last night, what d'ya say?"

A wide smile. "Yeah. Sounds great."

"So I guess this means you won't mind if I went after Cho, right?"

"Ron!"
~~

Comments

[sarahtales.livejournal.com]

Huzzah! Ron/Cho! I have a soft spot for it for some reason, after completely randomly writing it one day.
And like you could ever write gen. It's very clear who Harry has a crush on. I mean, he doesn't want Ron to know who it is, says so *so emphatically*...
Damn that forbidden Harry/Crabbe love, why does nobody see its beauty?

[ishuca.livejournal.com]

Damn that forbidden Harry/Crabbe love, why does nobody see its beauty?

:falls over and dies:

[ishuca.livejournal.com]

argh! the whole coming out thing always bothers me, too. of course, i think you know this. i'm not much a fan of just-dialogue fics, but this was nice. =^-^=

hee hee! i said the n-word. :smirks:

on a side note, i'm going to be reading that ficlet tomorrow. :sigh:
finally, a chance to leisurely read and write all day. :hugs:

[silviakundera.livejournal.com]

re: your ron&harry scene

awwwwwww... they're such little BOYS! Very nice, thoughtful attempt at realism. Endearing. :)


harry potter wouldn't even -know- words like gay, or `bi' especially.

I dunno. In my opinion, he'd definitely know the word gay. I mean, he grew up in the Muggle world. It's on the television, throughout the media. He went regular school with all the other kids up until he was 11. He spends the summers back in the Muggle world...

and, well, I'd wager a guess that Dudley's gang's taunting could very likely have included some gay slurs, if I know my pre-teen and teen bullys right.

(now Ron, on the other hand -- it depends what the author believes about wizard society and its treatment of homosexuality... whether it uses the same words, same attitude as western culture or not)

[silviakundera.livejournal.com]

and damn it, someday I'm going to actually write that fic dealing with Harry and Dudley's gang.

Really. I swear. ;)

[dancingrain.livejournal.com]

yay!

Lovely ficlet.

I think there's an even chance of Harry knowing about being gay; just that he's unlikely to fully understand it. He certainly hasn't had, say, a queer-friendly family with which to raise his first tentative questions. But he *does* go home to Muggle culture every summer, and I'm sure he finds ways to watch TV or read the paper or magazines from time to time, even if they're mostly ones Dudley would toss into the trash (shame on those Dursleys, no recycling!). He's probably heard the word, but as often as not in a "that's so gay!" etc context, so he'd have a sense of it being something one would rather not be.

But yeah, i agree, he's perhaps less likely to use the word about himself, or to think of himself that way. He seems not to identify as much, not to label himself much. He *would* think of it in the "I like guys" way, rather than the "I am a gay person" way.

[bookshop.livejournal.com]

Apparently this is my day to follow Maya around going "what she said."

This is itching to be made into an H/D next-parter. Blushing!Harry and Ear-biting!Draco are a match made in fandom. <3! Awww! *wants*

*tickles straight!Ron*

[holographis.livejournal.com]

If you bear in mind when Harry was growing up (5 or 6 years before I was born, I think), AIDS was in the newspapers *all* the time. Gay culture was out in the open in Britain for the first time, and it was everywhere. I know he lived in the cupboard under the stairs (actually, we have a cupboard like that under our stairs, and if I were any younger, I'd be seeing if I could live in there, but that's another story for another day) but he fetches the post as we see in the film and in the books, and if the Dursleys got a newspaper (highly likely, IMO, though as far as I know it's not mentioned in canon) he would at least have seen headlines about gay people. So I would imagine he'd know the word gay, and have a reasonable idea what it meant - I can imagine Vernon Dursley as one of the people who'd decry "those lousy faggots and their disease" and thank god he was a straight man every morning.

Just my two pennies.

[lasultrix.livejournal.com]

I liked the ficlet. A little fast at times, but very IC.

I think the chances of Harry not knowing the word 'gay' by the time he was fifteen or older are close to nil. Okay, he might not have known it when he got his Hogwarts letter (I was brought up in a permissive enough household, and I only learned homosexuality existed at the age of nine when my mother said "Er, you know what 'gay' means, right?' I said 'no', and she told me.) but I don't think he's any less likely to hear at Hogwarts. Yes, the library isn't likely to have books full of sociological queer-studies stuff, but you're not telling me that's how most kids learn about it. Unless the wizarding world is SERIOUSLY closeted, or homosexuality is really rare due to, I don't know, something genetic or the like, he's going to hear about it in his teenage years, even if he didn't hear before then.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

the n-word!!
*chokecoughcough* ...

ok, i can work with that. *growls a little, for appearances*


i'm actually a slight bit happier with this than with `tangent', because it's cuter.
you know, the cute. i'm all about the cute... ^^;

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

ah, so what you're saying is, you'd like me to write you harry/crabbe for your birthday >:D<
... i can work with that :D

*aims to please*

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

*laughs*
as long as i get to have ron in there somewhere. you know, ron.

my new favorite character >:D<
and yah. i was thinking of mike tyson with the ear thing. ahahaha. it's funny that you think it suits malfoy ;)

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

gah! now you think it's "nice" too ><;
hee. it's ok, i'm happy with nice. i think nice is nice. yes. and y'know, me, and realism have had "issues", so this is probably progress ^^

and yah, i shouldn't have said that about not knowing the word, i just don't think he'd use it on himself just like that.
"hello, my name is harry potter and i'm gay because this one boy gives me funny feelings." it's not so much the knowing as the using. and i was more saying the wizard boys are his conscious, present peer-group, and he'd probably act more like them than like the muggle boys.
but that's just conjecture. hee. guh, have to be careful about my late-night babbles, since everyone always jumps on the obvious blunder ><;;
so yes. i was mostly talking about "bi" anyway, since that's what the story i was reading used~:)

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

thankees~:)
and i'm glad you didn't focus on the "he wouldn't even -know- the word" aspect since that was just me being flippant and not very careful.
i was mostly focusing on the unlikelihood of his self-identifying as "gay", whatever fragments he's heard by age 11 or during the summers.
i mean. "i am gay" rings wrong to me, i guess. and no one ever writes it as "i like boys" which is surprising. since like, when -i- was his age and older even, i though of it as liking boys or liking girls and never thought of myself as "lesbian" or "straight" unless i was angstying privately over my various confusions, because the terms are so confusing. to me anyway. and i'm a muggle~:)

well, at least that's what most people think ^^

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

erk. yah, my bad. i didn't mean to focus on the not-knowing thing, was just mentioning it offhand as a possibility, mostly i was just quibbling with him using it initially on himself.
but yah, unlikely he doesn't know. of course, i definitely knew the word lesbian and refused to use it on myself for years just because it scared me.
but then, i hate labels more than most people, i guess ^^

and, hee! cupboard!
i've seen one of those. they're cozy~:)

[silviakundera.livejournal.com]

I think it really depends on what the wizard community's view on the whole thing is. If they treat homosexuality in the same manner as Muggles, well... when I was 14 I started wondering if I was "bi" and when I was 10 there was a boy in my class who a lot of people thought was gay -- who knows if he was, lost track of him when went to junior high -- and a few kids said the predictible "aren't you afraid he likes you?" bullshit to his guy friends in our class, and they said that if he IS gay, they really don't give a shit. and then no one ever mentioned it again.

and, in fact, it's that memory that I carry with me whenever I get depressed and hopeless about humankind.

I don't specifically remember the age when I didn't use the term gay. hmmm. Not in kindergarden or first grade, obviously. Probably 4th grade! That's when I remember beginning to really grasp sexuality. When my friends started kissing each other and such, and we all started crushing, and we started talking about that stuff.

"Bi" I didn't figure out until junior high.


But, yeah, I think you could make a case for a bisexual Harry thinking he's gay since he likes guys, and having to work out the bisexuality thing. *nods*

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

man, i feel really embarrassed about mentioning the not-knowing thing now, but, too late. it was just an offhand comment i didn't think much about, obviously ><;;
mostly it's a gut feeling that he wouldn't -say- it about -himself-, at first anyway. but yah, there's bound to be awareness of homoeroticism in a boy's dorm~:)
i haven't thought of that aspect. it was just the -word- gay that's all.
the word originated this century, didn't it? i mean, he could say "shirtlifter" and i'd be ok, although that's derogatory, y'know?

and while harry might know the word gay, ron might not, and it doesn't seem like a wizarding sort of word, but who knows....

and thanks~! in-character!ron is my holy grail ;)

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

wah. everyone is probably more socialized than i was ><;;
and, that story made me all warm&fuzzy~:)

i was mostly having to pick things up from the media and such. but... i mean... the -word- bi... seems so... muggle. technical. -progressive-. it's not so much that i think he would identify as gay -or- bisexual. identifying as bisexual usually comes later, not as soon as you realize you like the other sex too, but really i just meant it's a more complex concept and a more rarified word. and a more -muggle- word.

but i also wouldn't claim he'd identify as gay. he might, i guess, but most people are skittish at slapping such huge labels on themselves so early, with a history of liking girls to hide behind, if anything.
nobody would accuse him of it, so he could put it off, i guess. it's not like it's some badge of honor, so i don't see him being too eager to snap it up, for various reasons.

and even if you know the words "gay" and "bi", you can still avoid things being too serious and just say, i like "that person", or i like boys, or something.
i just see the word "bi" in particular as something of a euro-american slang word from the 60-90s. it's just painful seeing any fic where he's not totally gay to have him say, "i'm bi" and have ron just blink at him ^^

[silviakundera.livejournal.com]

huh. In my experience, younger people tend to grasp for the labels. Labels help us explain things and neatly box them up. They're life preservers to latch on to. And then later, when they're older, those adults start realizing how constraining they can be.

but, hey. everyone's experiences are different. ;) And I fully get where you're coming from what that.


i just see the word "bi" in particular as something of a euro-american slang word from the 60-90s.

Yes, but. The thing is, they *are* in Europe. In the 90's. And the wizard world isn't actually trapped in old times or anything. Their other social mores seem to blend with modern day thinking. (Full woman's rights, with girls playing on Quidditch teams right along with the boys, for instance.) They just have no *need* of much of the industrial revolution's technology, because they have magic to do those things for them. It's not about being trapped back in time, it's about not owning gadgets that they have no practical use for.


and blah blah blah. Okay, shutting up now. *g*

[ashkitty.livejournal.com]

Aww! That's totally sweet, and really pretty close to how I see such a conversation actually going. Go you! :)

[lincolnkw.livejournal.com]

Geep.

Hah, very enjoyable and the last two lines just made the story for me. Probably because someone said it to me when I had a conversation on the same topic. And I sort of have to agree with Silvia about the grasping for the label thing (at least as it pertains to contemporary teens) but can understand and accept your reasoning as to how it would work in the wizarding society. Especially considering that Harry grew up extremely sheltered (albeit against his will), and that Ron was as accepting of it as he was is a testament to the upbringing he had, and maybe to the fact that he's the youngest of five boys. the topic DOES come up on occasion among male siblings, if only joking or fighting.

Once again, I liked this, quite fun.

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

you know (ok, only getting to this now, but still), you made me realize i was probably talking out of my hat ^^
it's true, i was -resisting- labels so much when i was 14-18 because i was -obsessed- with them (i -had- to know whether or not i was lesbian, it's just i didn't -want- to be, because that'd be yet another freak thing). i mean -now- it doesn't matter, but it mattered then, and i -definitely- think it would be the same case of obsession (whether pro or con) for most other teens i can think of (well, now anyway).

so. you're right about that.
i just, i guess i was still pissed with it being like that, because it always makes me groan to read and it's rarely if ever handled at all well....

[yourpoison.livejournal.com]

*bounces*
thankees~!
it's always hit-and-miss, it seems, with me and realistic characterization. but i knew what i -wanted- this time, and that really seems to help for some reason ^^